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Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

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Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#671

Post by KingMob »

subscribed wrote: post #650
mmooss wrote: post #567

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not at all equivalent. > The president's literal argument for doing it is that the activist groups are coming for all of American life. What is American life? Why can't people criticize whatever they want - that is American life. > "Then they came for the Jews, and the administration finally deported the people who were coming for the Jews" The vast majority of antisemitism is on the right. The administration do…

But Zionism is not Judaism. Most of the pro-Palestine or anti-Zionist content I see is denouncing Israeli war crimes and genocide. No one is bashing Jews because of their ethnicity or religion. Also a lot of this comes from the Jews (who are then attacked for being confused or..... antisemitic) We're not at the point of people hunting Jews because they're Jews. We are at the point when opposing targeting/killing medi…

Got called a "self-hating Jew" for the first time on Mastodon a year ago, for criticizing Israel.

Unfortunately for those of us in the diaspora, Israel has really muddied the waters by convincing people that anti-Israel = antisemitism, because it's given real antisemites cover. E.g., like when the ADL came to Musk's defense after his Nazi salute because he officially supported Israel.

Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#672

Post by KingMob »

throwing_away wrote: post #259
ath3nd wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You’re not arrested for posting this Your funds might be cut off though: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/apr/07/trump-... Or your president might declare a wartime law to deport all the immigrants: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cp34ylep987o Or you, a honors student (but not a citizen) might find yourself in an unmarked van if you dared to question the powers that be. https://www.bbc.com/news/arti…

It's not unreasonable to see the situation as "Then they came for the Jews, and the administration finally deported the people who were coming for the Jews". The president's literal argument for doing it is that the activist groups are coming for all of American life. I'm not a big fan of either side's rhetoric, but clearly the horseshoe has become a ring.

Horseshoe theory is one of those idiotic centrist oversimplifications that pretends extremist differences don't matter.

It's like watching the rebels and the Empire shoot at each other, and saying "There's no difference, because they're both violent."

Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#673

Post by elcritch »

Braxton1980 wrote: post #580
elcritch wrote: post #559

Earlier quoted context omitted.

International students attending those events should probably be deported as well. Especially if they're helping to lead or promote them.

What about American citizens and why should they be treated differently?

They're American citizens and our problem to handle and tolerate?

Also the US is hardly unique in deporting extremists: https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2016/06/16/france-to-deport-n... https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cy48v8n389ro

Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#674

Post by HappyPanacea »

kombine wrote: post #605
yes_really wrote: post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Virtually all Israelis, both men and women, serve in the IDF from 18 to 21 years old. So the criticism is that Meta employs 100 Israelis out of its 74k US employees? That's 0.1%. The Indians and Chinese immigrants cover a much larger percentage. Does that mean that Meta is controlled by India and China?

[flagged]

> The burden of the proof should lie with the Israelis that they were not involved in committing war crimes.

This is the opposite of innocent until proven guilty, it is up to the accuser to present evidence not the other way around.

Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#675

Post by KingMob »

iddan wrote: post #566
SauciestGNU wrote: post #549

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't. The dissolution of a state implies nothing about the disposition of its people or a violent end to said state.

Easily overlooking the holocaust, the farhud and the pogroms. Israel was founded because Jewish people were not safe without a state.

FYI, I'm Jewish, with Israeli friends, and kibbutznik family on my great-grandaunt's side.

Israelis like you tell themselves this, but you don't speak for the diaspora. I personally feel that Israel makes the rest of us less safe, not more.

Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#676

Post by jl6 »

throw310822 wrote: post #391
dijit wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m too stupid to navigate this topic in anything other than a crude and adolescent way, however I think it could be tricky for pro-palestinians because they can fall easily into the trap of using party slogans used by proscribed organisations. My understanding of Hamas is that they are not considered a legitimate army, but if they were they would be guilty of an insurmountable number of war crimes (not unlike the ID…

> it could be tricky for pro-palestinians because they can fall easily into the trap of using party slogans used by proscribed organisations Any excuse is good when you have power and want to justify repression. For example they tried to claim that the slogan "from the river to the sea Palestine will be free" is genocidal . Quite a jump. (Meanwhile, the Likud's platform says "from the river to the sea there will be o…

> For example they tried to claim that the slogan "from the river to the sea Palestine will be free" is genocidal.

It’s actually just German for “The Bart, The”.

Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#677

Post by OhioMan2943 »

edanm wrote: post #645
simion314 wrote: post #643

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reddit is full of paid trolls that will pile in huge number to kill any discussion that is percived against Israel, you can\t talk about the latest war crimes Israel is doing without a number of accounts piling on you, accusing you of fascism, racis, that you do not know history, that the articles are false and no childrens were murdered, if they were some children killed then for sure some terrorists were hidding th…

Out of curiosity - how do you know they are paid trolls and not just people with those views on this issue? Personally, I don't use Reddit much, but this is definitely not the sense I get from seeing reading e.g. Twitter, in which there are plenty of extremely anti-Israel voices. Remember - we're all seeing our own personal echo chamber of content.

I don't use it too much, but I really recommend checking out the worldnews subreddit. Each story surrounding the me conflict is heavily curated, and the headline is chosen to minimise israeli culpability and direct discussion to other aspects. The comments are also overly vague and misdirecting, often focusing on different points and instantly tying in different issues which take a whole chain to address unpack, and then reorient towards the original discussion, even if having the guise of helpful discussion. You'll recognise it right away if you know what you're looking for.

The most common comments used to drown out actual criticism of israel and how to address its actions are actually the "aren't you glad we didn't vote for biden because he was bad for palestine" type. They will often be 4-5 of the top comments. Similar tactics are sadly used when discussing the crimes of the attack by emphasising the vileness of the acts in detail (despite both groups having plenty, and the world knowing both) and twisting the knife to make it too painful for people to engage with the discussion to exhaust them.

Let us not forget Israel has had a citizen driven hasbarah app which gives citizens "goals" (pre pasted propaganda messaged they are expected to post on their accounts) every morning to carry out online for over 7 years (reported by haaretz) https://youtu.be/iYzVOlcENZ4?si=IrN3FALmKVvIYkNJ I imagine it is much more discreet and efficient now.

Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#678

Post by edanm »

DAGdug wrote: post #649
edanm wrote: post #624

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In what way is this a conspiracy theory or guilt by association? I don't think it is. (Except maybe the statement that he's an Israel citizen, though I think in this context it's a legit statement to make.) The parent post explicitly makes two separate statements - 1. that he's an Israeli citizen, and 2. that he has questionable morals. I don't necessarily agree with the second statement, but it's explicitly not sayi…

On 2, a few additional quotes from Wikipedia might help (they admittedly don’t directly implicate Guy Rosen, though you’d have to be extremely charitable in assuming he wasn’t party to these decisions): “ Onavo, which allowed the company to read network traffic on a device prior to its being encrypted, thereby giving the company the ability "to measure detailed in-app activity" and to collect analytics on Snapchat ap…

There are in general a lot of different companies doing things which some segment of the population considers immoral. Around HN, things having to do with privacy-violations are often frowned upon by a large percentage of the population here.

I don't always agree with these assessments, and I even less agree that this means you can point to people at various positions in these companies and call them "immoral".

Some people will consistently hold the belief that anyone working at Facebook, or Google, or whatever, are immoral. Most will inconsistently hold that belief - if they're arguing against someone, they'll use this kind of reasoning, but not in general. I'm mostly against this line of thinking in general.

Look - In some corners of HN, having worked with or served in the US military in any capacity is enough to make someone immoral. In some corners, working at a gambling company in any capacity makes you immoral. In some corners, being a doctor in any way related to performing abortions is immoral. In others, taking part in the capitalist system in any way is immoral. I doubt you or anyone agrees with all of these positions - so I think the general rule is that just being associated with something that some portion of people think is immoral is simply not enough to consider someone immoral.

(There are of course things that almost everyone considers immoral, and being associated with them could be enough, though even that barometer is sometimes wrong.)

Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#679

Post by OhioMan2943 »

mlindner wrote: post #641

The problem is the pro-Palestine movement irrecoverably linked themselves to Hamas, a terrorist organization, it's made supporting Palestine a toxic position to hold for anyone of any significance.

Actually the Israeli government (Netenyahu) funded Hamas as a way to destabilise the Palestinian authority and conflate palestinianism with terrorism (EU Policy chief Joesep Borrell has stated this on record https://www.politico.eu/article/israel-funded-hamas-claims-e...)

Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#680

Post by edanm »

whamlastxmas wrote: post #661
edanm wrote: post #602

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article doesn't even prove that anything is dirty. It's just carefully insinuating that these takedown requests are wrong, without actually showing any proof of this.

Manipulating the free flow of speech is inherently wrong. They are demonstrably censoring pro Palestine content without any regard at all to pro Israel content, or even pro Israel content that incites or calls for violence

> Manipulating the free flow of speech is inherently wrong.

That is an absurd statement.

Almost every platform has mechanisms for taking down content, for good reason. Is asking to take down copyrighted content "inherently wrong"? Is asking to take down illegal content like child pornography "inherently wrong"?

What about someone publishing the name and address of a pro-Palestinian activist and saying "let's get together and kill him"? Would taking down that be wrong?

Without knowing the actual content that was asked to be removed, we can't judge whether it made sense or not.

> They are demonstrably censoring pro Palestine content without any regard at all to pro Israel content, or even pro Israel content that incites or calls for violence

Is this demonstrated in the article? I might have missed it but I didn't see any comparison to how pro-Israel content is handled.

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