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Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

nature.com

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Re: Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

#111

Post by amluto »

PaulRobinson wrote: post #45
jopsen wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Shops will just sell the sugar and the soda separately, mix it yourself :) Or people will pay more.

Not what has happened in the UK, where sugar tax has been a thing since 2018. It's now actually quite hard to find a sweetened drink - almost all soda-style beverages now are "zero sugar", sweetened with artificial sweeteners. Nobody is buying sugar and pouring it in. Nobody. It's a little too early to determine if this has slowed the prevalence of diabetes in the population. One problem is that other studies have sh…

It would be interesting to see the effect of a sweetness tax. See if the manufacturers can make desirable beverages that don’t taste so sweet (and don’t have whatever effect triggering sweetness receptors so intensely has).

Re: Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

#112

Post by SoftTalker »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #80
jacobgkau wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are transferring the problem from the foods industry to the pharmaceutical industry. I hope "one" knows that. The "bugs" are not in "the human," they're in the food industry. Fixing our food supply would be far better for individuals and society than fighting fire with fire by leaving our food broken and using drugs to work around it. In the meantime, doing what you can to unbreak your diet without using drugs is…

If this is your belief, then you do not understand the mechanisms by which GLP-1 agonists work. They silence the signals in the brain craving the unhealthy foods in question. You will never win against your brain chemistry.

Pharmaceutical companies would love for you to believe that. They salivate over the idea that they can convince you that you need their products for the rest of your life. They aren't any different from the common street dealer in many ways. They don't really care about your health, only that you keep coming back.

Re: Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

#113

Post by taeric »

Melting_Harps wrote: post #51
siliconc0w wrote: post #37

I'd bet a dollar per gram additive sugar tax in excess of 5g would immediately flatten the chronic disease curve. Maybe double that if it's marketed towards kids. There are a lot of problems besides sugar/HFCS but it's easily towards the top of the list.

> I'd bet a dollar per gram additive sugar tax in excess of 5g would immediately flatten the chronic disease curve. Maybe double that if it's marketed towards kids. There are a lot of problems besides sugar/HFCS but it's easily towards the top of the list. It doesn't, it doesn't even discourage the purchases unless (perhaps?) universally adopted: Boulder, CO has had a sugar tax for a while now, and all it does is pun…

I'm curious if you have data showing this? Last I heard, which a quick google seems to back up, is that Seattle's similar tax had modest benefits. (https://sph.washington.edu/news-events/sph-blog/sugar-sweete...) Took a brief look to see if there were strong challenges to this, but I didn't find anything.

Re: Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

#114

Post by Someone1234 »

llamaimperative wrote: post #88
bitmasher9 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I bet adding the sugar yourself would reduce consumption considerably. Which would be the goal of the tax.

Unfortunately Internet people like to point out the hypothetical 99th percentile person who would evade/be immune to such incentives and suggest that therefore, it would not be worth doing. It’s such a common and lazy pattern on HN :(

When I read those, I don't actually think those people believe their own arguments. They started with a conclusion, like "sugar taxes are bad," and then worked backwards to find an argument to fit it. That's why when you challenge them they just shift the goalposts.

Re: Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

#115

Post by m3kw9 »

exhilaration wrote: post #79
neom wrote: post #39

Interesting. I think folks in the comments here maybe missed this paper is way more about the beverages part making it important. The research is around sugar sweetened beverages (SSBs). If I'm reading it right, the SSBs have a differentmetabolic effect. "Due to their liquid form, SSBs are rapidly consumed and digested, resulting in lower satiety, higher caloric intake and weight gain. High doses of rapidly digested…

So taking myself as an example: I drink 12 oz of coffee daily (7 days per week), and I add exactly 12 grams of table sugar to my coffee each day (equivalent to 3 sugar packets), which is 45 calories. Seems like I don't have much wiggle room and should continue avoiding soda and juice.

Learn to drink it black, it’s good. But I do get beans and grind them so the brew is much higher quality. I’m assuming you drink that can of grinds for 3 bucks or instant. Those suck

Re: Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

#116

Post by wil421 »

brailsafe wrote: post #87
exhilaration wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So taking myself as an example: I drink 12 oz of coffee daily (7 days per week), and I add exactly 12 grams of table sugar to my coffee each day (equivalent to 3 sugar packets), which is 45 calories. Seems like I don't have much wiggle room and should continue avoiding soda and juice.

I'll be the guy that I assume most people are sick of by this point, and recommend experimenting with dropping the additives in exchange for higher quality coffee if you can afford it (it's usually not much more per cup). At effectively zero calories, after some period of time you'll get used to it and recalibrate your sense of sweetness to the point where sugary drinks and coffee are much less palatable

Just to add a bit, we bought a Breville espresso and grinder. I only use some whole milk to make my coffee and no sugar. My wife uses a little agave syrup and skips most of the milk.

Re: Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

#117

Post by bityard »

hombre_fatal wrote: post #68
trod1234 wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All carbohydrates eventually break down into sugars. Some quite a bit faster than others. What people and scientists haven't been saying in any meaningful way is the truth that carbohydrate poisoning is a real thing. If you eat too much, its harmful. Its common knowledge that medicines may become poisons when taken in too high amounts. This applies to most things in this area. Protein poisoning is fairly easily disco…

You don't think the scientific literature has anything to say about sugar surplus or junk food surplus? Carbohydrate poisoning sounds nonsensical though. Too many potatoes and whole grains, for example, aren't poisoning you. More people should be replacing junk food with those things. It's just a fad to use "carbs" as a euphemism for "junk food" and it only further confuses the discourse about nutrition.

I've noticed that people who want to deny that the extremely high carbohydrate content of the typical western diet is the major factor for runaway rates of diabetes and cardiovascular disease like to label the "bad" food as "junk food" or "ultra-processed food." But we never get an explanation from them as to what exactly is IN the junk food or ultra-processed food that causes the disease.

Re: Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

#118

Post by GeekyBear »

brailsafe wrote: post #87
exhilaration wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So taking myself as an example: I drink 12 oz of coffee daily (7 days per week), and I add exactly 12 grams of table sugar to my coffee each day (equivalent to 3 sugar packets), which is 45 calories. Seems like I don't have much wiggle room and should continue avoiding soda and juice.

I'll be the guy that I assume most people are sick of by this point, and recommend experimenting with dropping the additives in exchange for higher quality coffee if you can afford it (it's usually not much more per cup). At effectively zero calories, after some period of time you'll get used to it and recalibrate your sense of sweetness to the point where sugary drinks and coffee are much less palatable

I'll chime in to agree that it does take some time to get used to it, but after the transition period you don't miss it.

Giving up sweetened drinks and learning to cook healthy foods from scratch have been my most effective lifestyle changes.

Re: Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

#119

Post by xboxnolifes »

neom wrote: post #39

Interesting. I think folks in the comments here maybe missed this paper is way more about the beverages part making it important. The research is around sugar sweetened beverages (SSBs). If I'm reading it right, the SSBs have a differentmetabolic effect. "Due to their liquid form, SSBs are rapidly consumed and digested, resulting in lower satiety, higher caloric intake and weight gain. High doses of rapidly digested…

I'm always glad for more hard evidence, but this exact reasoning has been "common sense", or something to that tune, my entire life. Maybe not every individual resulting issue, but that liquid sugar absorbs more rapidly and as such is worse that an equivalent amount of sugar in a more solid meal.

Re: Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

#120

Post by JumpCrisscross »

Xeronate wrote: post #107
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 1g added sugar per serving That is still a good amount of sugar given it’s every day and setting your morning baseline. If taken with e.g. a refined juice or sweetened coffee, that’s probably setting one up for sugar cravings in a few hours.

1g of sugar per serving is hardly anything. You are weakening your argument by being hyperbolic.

> 1g of sugar per serving is hardly anything

I'll stand by it being "a good amount" given it's incorporated into a daily ritual.

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