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Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

nature.com

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Re: Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

#81

Post by [deleted] »

trod1234 wrote: post #59
neom wrote: post #39

Interesting. I think folks in the comments here maybe missed this paper is way more about the beverages part making it important. The research is around sugar sweetened beverages (SSBs). If I'm reading it right, the SSBs have a differentmetabolic effect. "Due to their liquid form, SSBs are rapidly consumed and digested, resulting in lower satiety, higher caloric intake and weight gain. High doses of rapidly digested…

All carbohydrates eventually break down into sugars. Some quite a bit faster than others. What people and scientists haven't been saying in any meaningful way is the truth that carbohydrate poisoning is a real thing. If you eat too much, its harmful. Its common knowledge that medicines may become poisons when taken in too high amounts. This applies to most things in this area. Protein poisoning is fairly easily disco…

[deleted]

Re: Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

#82

Post by pama »

hilux wrote: post #71

It's "good" that this is in Nature, but does any health-aware person not already know this? Our real problem is that most people aren't health-aware, and advertising (including the pharma-funded healthcare system) absolutely overwhelms common-sense truths about health. Over the past few years I have improved my own health by greatly limiting my intake of sugars, including by cutting out "healthy" smoothies, but I lea…

The HN title shortening is a bit misleading. The paper systematically analyzes the burden of this known effect on 184 countries.

Re: Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

#83

Post by nonameiguess »

trod1234 wrote: post #59
neom wrote: post #39

Interesting. I think folks in the comments here maybe missed this paper is way more about the beverages part making it important. The research is around sugar sweetened beverages (SSBs). If I'm reading it right, the SSBs have a differentmetabolic effect. "Due to their liquid form, SSBs are rapidly consumed and digested, resulting in lower satiety, higher caloric intake and weight gain. High doses of rapidly digested…

All carbohydrates eventually break down into sugars. Some quite a bit faster than others. What people and scientists haven't been saying in any meaningful way is the truth that carbohydrate poisoning is a real thing. If you eat too much, its harmful. Its common knowledge that medicines may become poisons when taken in too high amounts. This applies to most things in this area. Protein poisoning is fairly easily disco…

Protein poisoning happens because your body has a limited capacity to process protein. It's very high and you're unlikely to hit it, but it's happened to people living off the land and eating nothing but lean meat. Carbohydate processing is not inherently rate-limited like that. How much you need is dictated by how much you use. Even the stated numbers here about 9 weekly 8 oz drinks with 50 kcals or more per serving is comically miniscule compared to what is ingested with no ill effects by any serious endurance athlete who actually needs and uses that much energy. Carbohydrate only has a deleterious effect when you ingest more than you use, which is not characteristic of a poison.

Re: Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

#85

Post by jacobgkau »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #80
jacobgkau wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are transferring the problem from the foods industry to the pharmaceutical industry. I hope "one" knows that. The "bugs" are not in "the human," they're in the food industry. Fixing our food supply would be far better for individuals and society than fighting fire with fire by leaving our food broken and using drugs to work around it. In the meantime, doing what you can to unbreak your diet without using drugs is…

If this is your belief, then you do not understand the mechanisms by which GLP-1 agonists work. They silence the signals in the brain craving the unhealthy foods in question. You will never win against your brain chemistry.

"You will never win against your brain chemistry" is a defeatist way to dismiss taking basically any action, ever. People selling you artificial solutions will, of course, be incentivized to convince you that it's true.

Humans lived for thousands of years (without the widespread diet-related ailments we're seeing epidemics of today) without artificially "fixing" their own brain chemistry. This is not an internal medicine problem, it's an external food supply and societal lifestyle problem.

If you want to say it's too hard for you (you, only) to do what's required to not get sick and you'd rather rely on medicine, fine. But it is actually insulting to pretend like everyone needs a crutch just because you do. The main thing is that the crutch should be a last resort, and "willpower isn't a solution" should not be a common mantra to push the crutch as the first option.

Re: Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

#86

Post by ricardobeat »

athenot wrote: post #65
KittenInABox wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm curious what is the number of added sugars and above 50kcal peer 8 oz serving. You can get away with saying fruit drinks have no added sugar and still be insanely sugary.

Fruit drinks have a neat trick to increase sugar content. Take apple juice for example: you can evaporate water out of it till it's a sugary syrup, then add it to regular apple juice, and it's still called "100% pure apple juice no sugar added". (This is also done with various flavor essences from the juice, so they can recombine them in such a way as to produce a uniform flavor all throughout the year regardless of…

Not in the EU:

> It should be clearly indicated when a product is a mixture of fruit juice and fruit juice from concentrate

https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=celex%3A...

Re: Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

#87

Post by brailsafe »

exhilaration wrote: post #79
neom wrote: post #39

Interesting. I think folks in the comments here maybe missed this paper is way more about the beverages part making it important. The research is around sugar sweetened beverages (SSBs). If I'm reading it right, the SSBs have a differentmetabolic effect. "Due to their liquid form, SSBs are rapidly consumed and digested, resulting in lower satiety, higher caloric intake and weight gain. High doses of rapidly digested…

So taking myself as an example: I drink 12 oz of coffee daily (7 days per week), and I add exactly 12 grams of table sugar to my coffee each day (equivalent to 3 sugar packets), which is 45 calories. Seems like I don't have much wiggle room and should continue avoiding soda and juice.

I'll be the guy that I assume most people are sick of by this point, and recommend experimenting with dropping the additives in exchange for higher quality coffee if you can afford it (it's usually not much more per cup). At effectively zero calories, after some period of time you'll get used to it and recalibrate your sense of sweetness to the point where sugary drinks and coffee are much less palatable

Re: Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

#88

Post by llamaimperative »

bitmasher9 wrote: post #44
jopsen wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Shops will just sell the sugar and the soda separately, mix it yourself :) Or people will pay more.

I bet adding the sugar yourself would reduce consumption considerably. Which would be the goal of the tax.

Unfortunately Internet people like to point out the hypothetical 99th percentile person who would evade/be immune to such incentives and suggest that therefore, it would not be worth doing.

It’s such a common and lazy pattern on HN :(

Re: Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

#89

Post by ricardobeat »

xnx wrote: post #84

There is almost nothing* like sugar drinks in the natural world our bodies evolved in. Sugar drinks are about as different as tea leaves and pure cocaine. It's is no coincidence that both are refined white powders. *honey

I take it you haven’t tried a nice ripe mango from subtropical regions, or a pineapple, white grapes (or grape juice), watermelon, navel oranges? They can be sweeter than Dr. Pepper.

Sugarcane also exists and you can chew it.

They just tended to 1) come with fiber, 2) not be as easy to acquire or eat in large quantities 3) not available all year, or all at once

Re: Type 2 Diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar beverages

#90

Post by sitkack »

tanaros wrote: post #7
sitkack wrote: post #2

> Burdens of type 2 diabetes and cardiovascular disease attributable to sugar-sweetened beverages in 184 countries https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-024-03345-4.pdf The data and the code used for the analysis appears to be available. ---- One of the reasons that we don't have Universal Healthcare in the US is that things that are categorically unhealthy would be prohibited from being sold. Afterall, it would ben…

> One of the reasons that we don't have Universal Healthcare in the US is that things that are categorically unhealthy would be prohibited from being sold. Afterall, it would benefit not only the receivers of care but also the people funding the healthcare system. The sellers of those things will fight (to their death) to prevent that environment from existing. Perhaps you’re implying something unique about the US, b…

This argument by massive processed food industries, that if we get Universal Healthcare, that their products and practices will be curtailed because it will be for the actual monetary public good says nothing about what is sold in countries with public healthcare.

Are you saying that corporate processed food manufacturers are not making that statement?

Clearly there is a problem with soda consumption leading to obesity in countries with Universal Healthcare, but that isn't the argument I am making.

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