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Punk is dead and so are we

bananapeel.substack.com

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Re: Punk is dead and so are we

#111

Post by u32480932048 »

u32480932048 wrote: post #101
roflyear wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Partly, I guess in effect at least, but I would reject people are embracing lgbt rights because it is "cool" on the whole. It's more like, would you say women's lib was this type of fad? Or black rights? Etc.

It has absolutely become fashionable in the past few years, as evidenced by things the author (or maybe Hunter Thompson) wrote about, like having their own section in Target and ostensibly having support from Lockheed Martin (and every other company that wants to sell more products each June). The risk of yesterday is greatly diminished; "being LGBT++++" is now mostly a process of buying the right pronoun pins from A…

[flagged]

Re: Punk is dead and so are we

#112

Post by watwut »

zozbot234 wrote: post #105
watwut wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is nother more counter to the cultural moment then being a traditionally moral, upright citizen who doesnt do drugs, doesnt lie, cheat, steal, has their libido under control, is reliable, whose existence is profitable to the rest of the world (not neccessarily economically, just mean someone who contributes more than they take : financially, emotionally, etc) The drug use is going down, alcoholism is going do…

That's because the drugs and sex are getting replaced across modern culture by p0rn and video games. It's not a sign of spiritual growth, the young people of today's mainstream West are still mired in pointless craving and desire. Conservative religious communities offer a way out of that predicament. BTW the "conservative" part is not, strictly speaking, required but if you object to that I don't think you would lik…

Well, OP defined it as "doesnt do drugs, doesnt lie, cheat, steal, has their libido under control, is reliable, whose existence is profitable to the rest of the world". Porn and video games are not in those categories.

> Conservative religious communities offer a way out of that predicament.

They play video games. Also, per all available stats they do use porn.

Re: Punk is dead and so are we

#113

Post by tsylba »

mchinen wrote: post #24

There is a sort of nihilism that emerges when you look deeper at counterculture and it's conformity. Neo recognizing with horror the other neos is a great example. (In that case it only worked out for him because of hollywood's love of love - because he loved trinity so much he was really different from the rest.) I've often wondered how the leaders of the hippie, punk, and more modern movements would compare to clas…

80's Punks were the Tricksters of ancient mythology (eg. Coyote in amerindians culture), it always been the role of those at the margins of Society dealing with uncomfortable other realities, bringing liminal space into our collective consciousness. Punks are not dead, they (or more precisely their archetypal essence) have just shape shifted into another form we fail to recognize as we age while their prior shell have been consumed by mass media and commodification.

Chances are the future generation Punks are either that itch we can't quite name or out of our generational perception altogether.

Re: Punk is dead and so are we

#114

Post by BlueTemplar »

dfxm12 wrote: post #72
im_down_w_otp wrote: post #2

I think the author misattributed who the modern era punks would be. At least based on the described framework of what punk counter-culture was about and what it was countering. Given how much of the mainstream is organized around overwrought advertising, influencering, guruing, and being terminally online... it seems like the modern punks would be the counter-culture that prioritizes being offline, being private, and…

Counter culture is one thing, but the important bit is DIY, maybe more specifically DIT, do it together. This isn't about being offline, private, modest, etc., it's about seeing the rat race coming and stepping aside. They understand that ticketmaster & live nation probably own most of the venues in town, so if you don't want to play by their rules, you'll have to spend your entertainment dollars elsewhere, or if you…

Speaking of counter-cultural (?) publishing...

https://www.ecosophia.net/writing-as-microcosm-part-one-publ...

Re: Punk is dead and so are we

#115

Post by SleepilyLimping »

kevinsync wrote: post #85

I'm convinced that Juggalos are one of the only real countercultures in American society today.

My benchmark is how much social capital one stands to lose by admitting to be a member. If you're still admitting to be a Juggalo despite knowing what's associated with it, and how the mainstream is going to treat you, you're fine with those people being "your people" without anyone else.

Re: Punk is dead and so are we

#116

Post by zozbot234 »

dfxm12 wrote: post #107
DontchaKnowit wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my opinion, todays true counterculture is conservative religious communities. There is nother more counter to the cultural moment then being a traditionally moral, upright citizen who doesnt do drugs, doesnt lie, cheat, steal, has their libido under control, is reliable, whose existence is profitable to the rest of the world (not neccessarily economically, just mean someone who contributes more than they take : fi…

On the contrary, when you look at who holds power in the US, it is conservative religious people. From actual lawmakers to the media. They get to set the culture.

It would be nice if that was the case, but that's not how political and media dynamics work. Just because these folks like to pander to traditional values or spirituality doesn't mean that they'll be driven to further them meaningfully in their day-to-day work.

Re: Punk is dead and so are we

#117

Post by BlueTemplar »

silverquiet wrote: post #46
wizerdrobe wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know to what degree it’s “a thing” but I know a lot of 30-something punks from my old scene that are now into a kind of homesteading vibe. Moved out to the surrounding countryside as much for economic as ideological reasons. Some are all the way into off-the-grid, home schooling, etc. Nothing says “Fuck the System!” like solar panels and a wood burning stove I guess?

Well, as long as they don't move onto mailing letter bombs a la the Unabomber, it actually sounds pretty appealing to me too. Edit: I see I'm getting a couple downvotes which is fine; I get that the joke isn't in such good taste. The thing is that Kaczynski had a lot of the same critiques of modernity. Perhaps if he had not been a murderer/terrorist, his writing would be a bit more respected, but of course it is more…

Not sure how much that was specifically about attracting enough attention to get published, but it's possible that a few decades later he wouldn't have blown up anyone/anything, but instead started a blog ??

Re: Punk is dead and so are we

#119

Post by AndyNemmity »

ryukoposting wrote: post #66

This is a wonderfully-written piece, and it articulates the paradoxical nature of countercultures better than I've ever been able to. Punk Rock is dead, long live Punk Rock. I think there are real artistic countercultures out there, but they exist on the margins of art and society (as they must, innately). They're hard to discover, and even when they are discovered, they're inaccessible, bizarre, and disquieting (as…

I was listening to the Swans in the 90s, and I never felt they were abrasive, or uncomfortable.

I don't have much to add, I just felt it was interesting hearing them described through someone else's lens very differently than I would.

When I listen to them I hear beauty, and my childhood.

Re: Punk is dead and so are we

#120

Post by ishopatbakers »

zozbot234 wrote: post #105
watwut wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is nother more counter to the cultural moment then being a traditionally moral, upright citizen who doesnt do drugs, doesnt lie, cheat, steal, has their libido under control, is reliable, whose existence is profitable to the rest of the world (not neccessarily economically, just mean someone who contributes more than they take : financially, emotionally, etc) The drug use is going down, alcoholism is going do…

That's because the drugs and sex are getting replaced across modern culture by p0rn and video games. It's not a sign of spiritual growth, the young people of today's mainstream West are still mired in pointless craving and desire. Conservative religious communities offer a way out of that predicament. BTW the "conservative" part is not, strictly speaking, required but if you object to that I don't think you would lik…

> That's because the drugs and sex are getting replaced across modern culture by p0rn and video games.

This rings very true, look at kids not driving.

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