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iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

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Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#411

Post by jacquesm »

zeta0134 wrote: post #360
hurtuvac78 wrote: post #250

Apple being motivated by improving security are BS, and it pains me te see people in this forum falling for it or reapeating this. There is a great tool to increase security: the browser and its sandbox. You don't need to install anything fishy on your phone, and the sandbox rights coukd be sufficient for many apps. But as an example, Apple denies the full screen feature for websites and even PWA... only installed on…

The full screen feature works fine on websites for me? Well mostly fine, it's rubbish for games in particular due to a user hostile feature that forbids rapid screen taps, insisting that you might be using an on screen keyboard and denying you the autonomy to tell Safari to please not. But ignoring that, the feature seems to exist. What am I missing?

Interesting. You say it works fine and then in the same breath you make a point to show it isn't and then choose to ignore it. What you're missing is that Safari shouldn't have that bit hard wired in.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#412

Post by Vespasian »

jacknews wrote: post #77
EMIRELADERO wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would actually be illegal under the DMA: [...]gatekeepers shall: [...](f) refrain from requiring business users or end users to subscribe to or register with any other core platform services identified pursuant to Article 3 or which meets the thresholds in Article 3(2)(b) as a condition to access, sign up or register to any of their core platform services identified pursuant to that Article "Operating systems" i…

But that's the European law. Nothing stopping them locking sideloading for US Apple IDs I think? I mean they can't require an EU apple ID in order to access the sideloading feature, but they could deny it to US apple IDs.

They'll have to provide a way for edge cases like if someone moves from the US to the EU.

In General the US government will have to come up with their own version of the DMA if they or their voters deem it important.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#413

Post by wiseowise »

Kwpolska wrote: post #398
wiseowise wrote: post #361

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I wouldn't be surprised if Google pushes its own iOS marketplace: first by making an exclusive Blink-based Chrome to get people to open up their phones if they want to download "the real Chrome". Who even cares about Chrome on iOS? https://gs.statcounter.com/browser-market-share/mobile/north...

People who want their bookmarks and tabs synced between desktop Chrome and mobile?

And that amounts to 5-10%?

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#414

Post by jeroenhd »

cyberpunk wrote: post #61
heavyset_go wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, in a way, it is. All Microsoft has to do is revoke your application's signing certificate and Windows Defender will prevent it from running on Windows computers. Apple does the same thing with Notarization and Gatekeeper on macOS. If they choose to revoke your signing certificate, Gatekeeper will prevent your software from running on macOS. That means if you do, say or compete with something that Microsoft…

How come I can run so much software compiled from source then?

Likely because you've either disabled some of the overbearing security mechanisms at some point (smartscreen is a toggle and it's really frustrating if you're setting up a compiler toolchain) or you're running files that were produced on the local computer. If you disable all the privacy invading checkboxes during Windows setup (most don't), you partially neuter smartscreen as well.

Every browser I know uses the Mark of the Web to tell Windows that a file came from the internet. You'll have to store the file on a FAT32/exFAT drive to get rid of it. If a file comes from the internet, smart screen kicks in.

When a file is unsigned, smartscreen essentially prevents you from running the file. You can work around it, but I had to look up a tutorial myself.

If the file is signed, metadata will be extracted and submitted to Microsoft. If that fails or the exact binary hasn't been run on a certain amount of computers, smart screen will show a big scary warning despite your $500 a year digital signing certificate. This is something developers just have to deal with every time they update their applications, but most people won't be the first x to download the executable and applications using auto updaters download updated in the background can the necessary flags to work around smartscreen.

The restrictions are there, but they're not there for (most) development environments and for most users of popular software.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#415

Post by codethief »

vladvasiliu wrote: post #171
tpxl wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I'm concerned if you 'bought' something, it should be yours to do as you please, including reselling and destroying it. If you didn't buy something, but rented it - for example a game on Steam or Epic Games store - then it should damned say so. It's a straight up lie to say you purchased something if you didn't.

I don't think those alternatives are the right ones. You can sell your iphone without any issue, there are plenty of stores around me offering to buy used models to resell. I'm actually contemplating buying a used model. Can't do that with steam games. I'm also pretty confident that if apple and their services disappeared tomorrow, my iphone would keep on working just like it does today. Sure, no more updates, no mor…

> I'm also pretty confident that if apple and their services disappeared tomorrow, my iphone would keep on working just like it does today. Sure, no more updates, no more new apps, it would be frozen in the state it's in.

I think you're underestimating how much of the iPhone's functionality depends on Apple's servers being available beyond just installing & updating apps: Think push notifications, backups, iCloud, iMessage, no more Safari updates (shiver), …

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#416

Post by Vespasian »

walterbell wrote: post #130

Option 1: one-time cost for EU compliance, applied uniformly in other countries without geo-specific overhead, reducing ecosystem pressure for additional litigation and regulation. Option 2: minimal EU-only compliance, generate A/B economic data for antitrust lawyers and regulators in other countries to compete on platform neutrality, which can be incorporated by EU in a spiral of regulatory FOMO.

Since Option 1. require them to look further than the next 1 or 2 years it'll absolutely be Option 2 I think.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#417

Post by bjornsing »

Nursie wrote: post #406
hooby wrote: post #143

I think the central question here is: .) whether you buy a phone as a piece of hardware and then own that hardware - which gives you certain rights regarding the usage of that owned hardware or .) whether you are just paying some sort of admission fee to a tightly controlled service, and are basically "lent" a piece of hardware that you have no ownership rights over. All the other stuff about walled gardens, monopoli…

I don’t think it’s accurate to say you are conferred no ownership in the current model - this reads as typical tech binary thinking. It’s either fully under my control or I have nothing! For most people the ownership aspect is covered by being able to buy and sell the devices freely, and decide what apps to put on them. They are (and before I’m accused of being patronising, I am in this group) happy with a device tha…

I agree. Legal ownership rights do not guarantee a particular feature set. For example your ownership of a car does not entail a right to easily install whatever software you want on all the CPUs in it.

But I don’t think it’s right to call this binary thinking. It’s just incorrect thinking.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#418

Post by Nursie »

heavyset_go wrote: post #339
meling wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think users really want to have to use 5 different app stores. I’ll probably opt to not buy an app if I first have to download another App Store app.

That's not the case for billions of people on Android or macOS and their respective app stores.

How many people actually bother to set up another App Store though?

A subset of Kindle users who want “real” google apps?

I very much doubt it’s billions.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#420

Post by __tmk__ »

ko27 wrote: post #383
zacksiri wrote: post #242

[flagged]

Is anybody else upset that people are actively making up stories to prop up Apple on HN? Most of what you said is misleading or false: > Here in Thailand banking apps fraud is rampant Citation needed (on the "rampant" part). > Most of the cases are found to be on android devices Even if it's true most of the phones in Thailand are Android. > clicking some link that installs some app Not possible the way you describe…

I think my banking app disallows taking screenshots of it. (Presumably this also means it would be hidden from screen recordings? Not quite sure.)
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