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iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

techcrunch.com

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Re: iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

#421

Post by boring_twenties »

rovr138 wrote: post #386
kevviiinn wrote: post #328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So are malware vendors looking for who spends the most on software or for biggest impact through sheer number of installations

I'm guessing they're looking for the users they can steal the most from in the least amount of time. Aka, the most lucrative. Apple's ecosystem means that most of the devices are up to date, or close, and because they control the full pipeline, things behave better. This means that targeting ios is easier (since they'll be on closer versions and behave uniformly) and that because they spend more money, which they hav…

> This means that targeting ios is easier

I don't think so? Android devices are much more likely to be vulnerable to well-known exploits. Stealing keys and passwords of course is much easier if your app can get root on the device.

Re: iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

#422

Post by boring_twenties »

GeekyBear wrote: post #206
jclardy wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm the opposite, as looking at android, where do we see this? All big players are still in the play store, because the average user of those services doesn't want to be bothered going to a website, clicking scary looking buttons to enable third party installs, then manually update their own installed apps. Basically the risk would be someone like TikTok dropping out of the store, but I find that unlikely. Maybe at t…

> I'm the opposite, as looking at android, where do we see this? Where do we see Android devices with apps like Facebook preinstalled, unremovable and granted root permissions? All over the ecosystem.

Preinstalled and unremovable, sure. I've never heard of Facebook being given root, though? Do you have any more info about this?

Re: iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

#423

Post by arcticbull »

WastingMyTime89 wrote: post #410
yamtaddle wrote: post #337

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An alt-store stands to capture more value on iOS than Android, and spying on iOS users is probably a whole lot more lucrative than spying on Android users. That, combined with the App Store restricting spying more than the Play Store does, is why we can't necessarily expect the iOS ecosystem to behave the same way as Android's, were iOS to get similar side-loading capabilities. A common argument goes that nothing wil…

> An alt-store stands to capture more value on iOS than Android, and spying on iOS users is probably a whole lot more lucrative than spying on Android users. How so? I think American Apple users just don’t realise how insignificant Apple market share is outside the US. Android was open from the start. Giant like Amazon tried to kickstart alt stores. What did happen? Nothing. I think people should stop drinking Apple…

- 27.71% worldwide is iOS.

- 56% in the US.

- 34% in Europe.

- 18% in Asia.

- 13% in South America. [2]

That all in mind Apple has 85% of the global share of smartphone profits. [1] Many Android players have a negative profit share.

[1] https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-02-03/iphone-gr...

[2] https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/mobile/

Re: iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

#424

Post by 35208654 »

throwaway290 wrote: post #133
35208654 wrote: post #121

It seems like everyone in these discussions sees only two worlds: lawless hellscape of intrusive, data-stealing apps that permit freedom or “walled garden” of good apps that restrict it and users’ freedom. The truth, as always, is already somewhere in between. And it will be after iOS 17. Let’s see how Apple innovates in this space. It’s time. The iPhone is 16 years old this year. Time to users get behind the wheel i…

My nightmare scenario is if every country and mobile reseller will come up with their own app store, and pre-load/make users use those. Once Apple gave in, they will press further to make this happen. These stores would onboard Facebook and other big apps, but regular solo dev will have to submit each app to a dozen of different stores and comply with a dozen of different requirements and review processes or pass on…

The EU is pushing for (has already ratified?) rules against even pre-installing Apple apps, or at least making it easy to remove them. I’m certain that Apple, who sells their phones directly, will be able to keep the carrier bloat at bay.

But I also share that concern. It’s one reason I don’t use android as a daily driver.

Re: iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

#425

Post by arcticbull »

sjsdaiuasgdia wrote: post #213
hoffs wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Citation needed

For the money part, https://www.businessofapps.com/data/app-revenues/ iOS is 15% of the mobile device market but generates 67% of the app revenue.

Also 85% of all the profit in the entire global smartphone market. [1] Roughly speaking nobody makes profit in smartphones other than Tim.

[1] https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-02-03/iphone-gr...

Re: iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

#426

Post by fauxpause_ »

bena wrote: post #145
darkwater wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't have the freedom to choose the version of the app I want. And now I can't actually trust any of the apps out there because none of them are required to follow any of Apple's guidelines. You don't have that "freedom" right now either, it's just the Apple Store one. Also the law is about giving options on the distribution system, not on "app versions". So if Epic or 37 Signals use their own channel to distrib…

Right, but the person I responded to spoke as if this was going to be a way to increase consumer choice. It's not. Everyone will not get "the privacy/control tradeoff they want". They're going to get whatever the creator of the app decides. And sure, for TODO apps, you can choose from the 15 billion ones out there. But if you want ride-sharing, you have Lyft and Uber. If you want specific services, you will have to u…

I would rather pay less for Ubers than have Apple’s protections. I would rather pay less for Uber and have Apple’s protections.

Apple will still offer Uber, but they will take a smaller cut. Uber will still be available on the App Store because it is the most common App Store.

Re: iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

#427

Post by HeckFeck »

kaba0 wrote: post #309
HeckFeck wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the free market failed to implement a meaningful competition for central app stores. I don't want every component of my phone OS broken apart and subject to what some legislator or lobbyist thinks is 'competition'. The competition is between Apple and Google making mobile platforms and we already had a choice. I chose Apple's approach after a few years with Google. I miss the headphone jack, but having no tacky tra…

2 is no choice, that’s just ridiculous.

More platforms would be better but the answer is for someone - commercial or some free software initiative - to get a usable and supported device to market, not making impositions on an already established platform with its own strengths and legions of customers who are willing to pay slightly more because of them.

Re: iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

#428

Post by seba_dos1 »

vbezhenar wrote: post #345
kaba0 wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just make it hard to sideload, like the android dev mode. Then your grandma won’t install anything, but power users can actually use their general purpose devices as such.

Power users can already sideload anything on iPhone. It's not even hard. I guess the whole talk is about making side-loading easier.

It used to not be possible at all, and now you still have to repeat it regularly if you want to keep using the sideloaded application, which makes it close to useless for anything else than development. Of course, as expected from Apple, doing it from another OS than macOS is a huge PITA too.

Re: iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

#429

Post by kyriakos »

rched wrote: post #406
kyriakos wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Adult and Gambling have different compliance requirements with banks and payment processors, some outright don't allow dealing with these types of content/marketplaces (have a look at Stripe's T&C as an example). Apple and Google would rather not get into these markets than dealing with the legal complexities, this is the reason they are blocked. If they were doing it for the good of the users they would have just bl…

> Apple and Google would rather not get into these markets than dealing with the legal complexities, this is the reason they are blocked I find this claim pretty suspect. What are you basing this on? I'm sure the extra income would be vastly more than the cost of dealing with legal complexities.

On the fact that they don't allow them in the first place.

Re: iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

#430

Post by gerash »

TexanFeller wrote: post #10

I'm dreading this. I want privacy hostile companies like Facebook to have to comply with the app store rules and respect system settings relating to privacy. As a user, I'm thrilled when Apple wields its big stick to stop big tech companies from overreaching. Before there was a bit of a compromise, I could use evil apps with some peace of mind that they wouldn't do something egregious. Now I suspect evil apps just wo…

This reminds me of the "protections" real estate agents provide by taking a "meager" 5% commission on a home sale. Right now it seems practically impossible to sell a house without the involvement of an agency. I wish we could get rid of these overpaid middle men for filling out a bunch of forms and taking zero risk.

I feel what Apple is doing is taking 30% of what you pay to e.g. Spotify as a middle man because they made the device and can dictate whatever terms they please. How are people ok with this is beyond me.

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