Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

OpenAI tech gives Microsoft's Bing a boost in search battle with Google

reuters.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

421–430 of 601 posts

Re: OpenAI tech gives Microsoft's Bing a boost in search battle with Google

#421

Post by magicalist »

o8o8o8o wrote: post #167

The rumour I keep hearing is that it's like the Hunger Games inside Google at the moment. Total chaos and infighting at all levels, investors are freaking out over AI and Bard's middling performance compared to OpenAI and blood is in the water. Sundar may be forced to resign and Larry/Sergei deployed to rescue the company.

> investors are freaking out over AI and Bard's middling performance

Investors are generally the last people you want to go to for advice, but the stock market clearly disagrees with your rumor (was it from blind or reddit?).

To me it's clear search isn't where the exciting LLM stuff is (at least not yet), and this article indicates users feel the same way (+15.8% for Bing, +-0% for Google). Even the hn echo chamber doesn't really care that much about Bing search, they mostly care about Sydney, jailbreaks, etc, which is why the neutering into a better behaved search product pissed people off so much.

ChatGPT plugins, Copilot (X), this is where the interesting stuff is today. Google's late again on that, but a) just barely and b) Google Cloud is already a distant third place. Unlike search, they don't have to beat the world or kill any golden goose to have a win in that space (they just have to actually ship something).

Re: OpenAI tech gives Microsoft's Bing a boost in search battle with Google

#422

Post by throwaway9980 »

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #330
i_have_an_idea wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I don't particularly see the value of having the founders back - they haven't been hands on for a real long time.

Larry and Sergey are radioactive post-MeToo. I'm not sure how people manage to constantly forget the extent of their misbehavior and misconduct of Harvey Weinstein-level proportions. But it's there, and if they come out of their private island hidey-holes, they will almost certainly get reminded of it, very publicly. Also, they have absolutely no reason to. Both have more money than they could ever spend in several g…

> the extent of their misbehavior and misconduct of Harvey Weinstein-level proportions

That’s a pretty significant accusation considering Weinstein is rotting in prison for the rest of his likely short existence.

I’ve never heard any of this except maybe one of them had an affair. Can you pull some of this out of the memory hole that it’s apparently been dropped into?

Re: OpenAI tech gives Microsoft's Bing a boost in search battle with Google

#423

Post by unshavedyak »

user3939382 wrote: post #418
unshavedyak wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Funny, so far i've been just asking it things i normally ask Google. Same paranoia of answers that StackOverflow/etc give me, but far quicker and more responsive. TBH i'm not sure under what scenarios people search into Google expecting perfect answers. Ie where we're disappointed by incorrect information. I filter through a dozen wrong answers on Google every day. Why is it different if it's from ChatGPT?

I guess one difference is that I have a lot (decades?) of experience in the types of errors humans tend to make. Humans have certain biases, certain blindspots, etc. In programming for sure, there are very strong patterns in the types of mistakes we make that tend to be a function of skill or experience. So you (I) look for those without even thinking about it. Violation of YAGNI, ACID, DRY, pre-mature optimization,…

Good points. I think it also helps that i purposefully avoid asking for things that i can't validate. The easier it is to validate the more likely i am to ask.

I find ChatGPT especially great with giving starting points. It kinda feels like 10 (or something... time?) years ago when i discovered how good Google was at finding movies based on vague wishy-washy definitions. If i don't know what to call something ChatGPT does a better job at pointing me in the right direction. Often giving the right answer.

But i'm not saying it has lasting power. We'll see. So far i'm using Search engines less than ever.

Re: OpenAI tech gives Microsoft's Bing a boost in search battle with Google

#424

Post by sebastianconcpt »

this_user wrote: post #258
i_have_an_idea wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, Sundar and Google leadership have been massively outmaneuvered here by both Nadella and OpenAI. It's really quite embarrassing, particularly in the context of the fact that Google was the undisputed leader in AI for over a decade. As a Alphabet shareholder, I won't be sad to see Sundar go.

It seems to be more complacency on the part of the Google. They became larger and larger without really delivering anything new. When was the last time they launched a major new product that truly had a lasting impact on the level of Search, Maps, Gmail, Android? It has been a while. Too many of their resources seem to be focused inwards on hypothetical questions like AI ethics that keep them from actually building t…

Google Plus?

Re: OpenAI tech gives Microsoft's Bing a boost in search battle with Google

#425

Post by caskstrength »

Aunche wrote: post #305
faeriechangling wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is Sundar a bad CEO or merely a mediocre one though? Who would replace him that could get the job done where Sundar failed? I think it's easier said than done to stay the undisputed leader in AI for over a decade even if your leadership is above-average. Still Sundar is mediocre at best, and I certainly think Google's shareholders should be looking for a new person to run the place. It's not just AI, Google's entire…

I don't think Sundar is bad per se. Rather, he is doing what most Googlers are doing which is resting and vesting off of that sweet ad money. It's unlikely that GPT is as monetizable as ads, so it's possible that he still loses even if he wins the AI race. As for a better alternative I think that the Susan Wojcicki, the former CEO of YouTube, is highly underated. She made a lot of unpopular decisions for the public,…

> She made a lot of unpopular decisions for the public, but all of them successfully protected YouTube from existential threats (copyright holders, advertisers, and TikTok).

How did Youtube Shorts protect anything?! They failed to compete with TikTok but keep antagonizing loyal Youtube users with these unremovable crap.

Re: OpenAI tech gives Microsoft's Bing a boost in search battle with Google

#426

Post by cowthulhu »

nirav72 wrote: post #413
o8o8o8o wrote: post #167

The rumour I keep hearing is that it's like the Hunger Games inside Google at the moment. Total chaos and infighting at all levels, investors are freaking out over AI and Bard's middling performance compared to OpenAI and blood is in the water. Sundar may be forced to resign and Larry/Sergei deployed to rescue the company.

The thing that I don’t understand is that google had every advantage in this AI race. They have the largest amount of training data than anyone. Not just internet data. But also geospatial data, video, images and books. Among other collected data. Including a huge lead and deep pockets for research. Yet, somehow they got caught off guard.

That’s what kills me about this. They’re like, the kings of data - they’ve got (arguably) the best web scraper, as well as tons and tons of compute and consumer data. And some company famous for making a DOTA bot beat them to the punch by a huge margin? That’s pretty pathetic IMHO.

Re: OpenAI tech gives Microsoft's Bing a boost in search battle with Google

#427

Post by soiler »

super256 wrote: post #377
faeriechangling wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is Sundar a bad CEO or merely a mediocre one though? Who would replace him that could get the job done where Sundar failed? I think it's easier said than done to stay the undisputed leader in AI for over a decade even if your leadership is above-average. Still Sundar is mediocre at best, and I certainly think Google's shareholders should be looking for a new person to run the place. It's not just AI, Google's entire…

> Is Sundar a bad CEO or merely a mediocre one though? I don't know, but I'm really sad to see how Android is currently performing in rich countries. Not stagnating, but losing. Here, in Germany, Android had a market share of over 70%(!). But over the last three years alone, Apple started eating Android's lunch and iOS' market share has increased from 28% to 38%, while Android's has decreased by the same amount (from…

> Personally, I'd say that at least Google's Android department is currently headless and has no idea what the users want.

The clock change, while minor, really put the nail in the coffin for me. I have very little optimism for Android. Luckily, it still allows me to use an app to revert the clock display to an readable clock display. I don't particularly want to switch to iOS and I am happy about GrapheneOS, but it's still going to suffer from bad decisions coming from Android.

Re: OpenAI tech gives Microsoft's Bing a boost in search battle with Google

#429

Post by aleph_minus_one »

zarzavat wrote: post #397
aleph_minus_one wrote: post #382

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If there were a GoogleCode, would anybody use it, or would it be DOA for the same reasons as Stadia? There was Google Code, a service that was similar to GitHub. Google Code was closed down on January 15, 2016 (source: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Google_Developers... ).

True but I meant GoogleCode as an analogy to VSCode i.e. a Google text editor / IDE. It’s very telling that Google has never entered that market: the closest is Android studio which is just JetBrains.

> True but I meant GoogleCode as an analogy to VSCode i.e. a Google text editor / IDE. It’s very telling that Google has never entered that market

Google did at least one attempt of creating an IDE (I can not judge from the outside, though, how serious this attempt was): Google Collide

YouTube video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Gq12bLbm54 (jump to 1:45 to see it in action).

Well, Google open-sourced it in 2012 (i.e. shot it down): https://www.wired.com/2012/07/google-open-sources/

A fork of Google Collide on GitHub (its last commit was from end of 2018, though): https://github.com/WeTheInternet/collide

Re: OpenAI tech gives Microsoft's Bing a boost in search battle with Google

#430

Post by mrkramer »

_8j50 wrote: post #304
this_user wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems to be more complacency on the part of the Google. They became larger and larger without really delivering anything new. When was the last time they launched a major new product that truly had a lasting impact on the level of Search, Maps, Gmail, Android? It has been a while. Too many of their resources seem to be focused inwards on hypothetical questions like AI ethics that keep them from actually building t…

MS had same problem under ballmer. Complacency starts at top.

Ballmer at least brought us Bing and sticked to it. So he wasn't that bad except missing trillion dollar opportunity called non-Apple mobile operating system that turned out to be Android not Windows Phone.
Post reply on HN