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Hidetaka Miyazaki sees death as a feature, not a bug

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Re: Hidetaka Miyazaki sees death as a feature, not a bug

#91
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To note, there are many other mechanisms to adjust the playing experience than a difficulty slider or an explicit "easy" mode. I think a lot of us prefer a more natural and "legit" integration of different paths into the gameplay. It requires more effort and creativity on the developer side, but it also allows players to move from laid back/easier playing to more demanding play in a seamless way. To put it in your te…

Oh yeah, you can make lots of choices on how to integrate them or what features to offer! Celeste assist mode lets you control the game engine's speed, modify how many jumps you have, etc. Hades gives you a mode where you get a permanent 2% health buff every time you die that allows the game to meet you where your capabilities lie instead of of forcing you to guess.

I think you touch on why a singular difficulty level can be good when you mention meeting where your capabilities lie instead of forcing you to guess. When I encounter something difficult in a game, I'm always tempted to turn the difficulty down and often do. With Souls games I explicitly know if something is too hard and take it as a sign I need to do something different; whether that's my mechanical technique or the need to explore more. An increasing buff or other difficulty helpers would mean I could eventually brute force my way through without considering other options. Maybe I would prefer that, but it would just be a guess unless I did it the other way.

Re: Hidetaka Miyazaki sees death as a feature, not a bug

#92
post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, that sucks for those people. I don't think framing it as a moral failure on Fromsoft's side is right though. It's an artistic decision, not a 'haha, go fuck yourself you armless twats' one.

It's not one or the other. It's both an artistic decision to leave no remote possibility of altering the difficulty, and a moral one to exclude folks whose disabilities make the game vastly more difficult than it is for others. They're responsible for both.

People with disabilities have beaten Fromsoft games. There are numerous accounts of that. From what I have seen, it's usually people without actual disabilities propping them up as a shield for their own laziness and excessive need to chase the current trend.

In short, they want the reader's digest version.

Re: Hidetaka Miyazaki sees death as a feature, not a bug

#93
post #80

What people seem to miss IMHO, is that this is "difficulty" thing is a time trade-off deeply ingrained in this type of game design. The frustration as you learn the rules of the game and try to improve this particular set of dexterity brings exhilarating satisfaction once you overcome the previously deemed impossible obstacles. But this also means that you need to have the time to plunge into this type of long-form c…

Yep great observation. I started my first FromSoft game last week - Demons Souls remake - and I had no idea what was going on. Making very little progress and restarting levels over and over. So I decided to follow a guide and the game has become so much fun. It’s quite a bit easier because I’m not dying thousands of times to find which way to go. But I wouldn’t have kept at it otherwise.

Re: Hidetaka Miyazaki sees death as a feature, not a bug

#94
post #58
post #2

>I do feel apologetic toward anyone who feels there’s just too much to overcome in my games Psh, I ain't buying it. I think they found a niche and like sticking to it, and maybe like making folks salty. They make a ton of people happy with the difficulty, but nothing about these games are apologetic.

As other comments say, the difficulty has been oversold. I don't know what your experiences with these games are, but there are lots of forgiving aspects to them that wouldn't be there if they just wanted to make the hardest games on the market. Here's a few: - every death refills your main healing items, so you can't run out - you keep all the items you collect before you die - you can recover lost experience points…

Demon's Souls was much more difficult in some ways, because you got weaker when you died (zombified), and your potions are consumable items that don't automatically recover. However you could also farm lots of potions, so there were ways to game it.

Beating Demon's Souls on a tiny CRT in an even tinier Japanese temp-apartment is one of my most cherished gaming memories.

Re: Hidetaka Miyazaki sees death as a feature, not a bug

#95
post #72
post #34

I think Miyazaki's games are great and I enjoy them myself, but the continued (even in this article, somewhat) framing of accessibility features as ruining the artistic vision of hardship is a little disingenuous at this point. Many disabilities make games several times more difficult than they are for people without them, and a difficulty slider or increased stats help level the playing field so that the games can b…

I think the problem with a difficulty slider is that it puts lots of extra burden on the developer. Balancing difficulty is already tricky, and now you have to do it n times? And a newcomer to the series might choose "easy", which is not the intended experience for the average player. My proposal is an "a la carte" difficulty instead, where you choose what mechanics you want to mess with. You could get unlimited estu…

This is really the answer. I don't know why every (singleplayer) game doesn't do this. I know some players like to complain that it ruins the game, but I can't see how. There will always be the default/designed way to play the game, available for anyone who wants it.

I grew up with games before ubiquitous internet access, where you could edit game files easily. If I wanted to play a game regularly I could, and if I wanted to edit stats, I could. It's just a form of meta agency on gaming. It's about having fun, and I think a lot of purists have lost that, at least when it comes to denying others their way of fun.

Re: Hidetaka Miyazaki sees death as a feature, not a bug

#96

I heard about these gamed and watched a few hours of gameplay each. I was unconvinced and closed the YouTube tabs after it became too boring. I guess I have to play it to feel it? But most of the games I enjoy playing are fun to watch. Duke3d and Baldurs Gate are two examples. Can someone elaborate why Dark Soul is actually fun to play, and more importantly why sold for so many copies? I read other comments and the t…

I tried Dark Souls multiple times and I just find it dreadfully boring.

I like video games to challenge my mind, not how fast I can duck-roll-dodge-hit-dodge-roll-hit and so on for 10 minutes to kill a boss or whatever.

Re: Hidetaka Miyazaki sees death as a feature, not a bug

#97

I'm new to From Soft games and decided to buy Elden Ring because it's a similar game to Zelda Breath of The Wild which I really liked. I was afraid that the game would be too difficult. After playing 17hrs, the game is indeed difficult but there are many things you can do in the game to make it easier for yourself (Which I did because I'm more interested in exploring the world than mastering the gameplay). For exampl…

> This is essentially the easy mode everyone wanted but the core souls fans. This easy mode has been in every From game I’ve played. It’s the reason core fans don’t want the much-demanded difficulty settings.

This is also true for BOTW. My wife, who plays very little, grinds healing and stat increases before boss fights. I think the difficulty argument is just some dumb journo-take that guarantees easy outrage clicks.

Re: Hidetaka Miyazaki sees death as a feature, not a bug

#98
post #14

I bought ER the other day after hearing rave review and was super disappointed. I ended up returning it after a couple hours. * Visuals: Disappointing. Looked like a cheap free-to-play MMO. Cheap-looking textures, stock-looking characters, bad rigging (e.g. characters holding things in unnatural poses), etc. * Controls: Unpleasant. Controls felt very sluggish. If this is supposed to make the game more challenging or…

You are definitely missing something. You just had your first whiskey and you don't have a palette for it yet.

I had a very similar reaction when I first played Bloodborne, especially to the controls. I'm very into tight, kinetic controls, like in Donkey Kong Country and Super Meat Boy. Bloodborne felt squirrely and didn't appeal to me at all. I returned it.

The game didn't stick for me but Dark Souls 3 did, and over time I came to understand. The controls are perfect for these games, Elden Ring included. It's just an acquired taste, and I think you need to understand the gameplay mechanics and control paradigm to really see why they're perfect. It's hard to explain -- more just something to understand and feel. That said, I'll try and give you a few tips:

First off, the foundational difference between the Souls genre and every other game you've ever played is this: movements cannot be interrupted. You attack, and you are committing to that attack. The animation will play out until the end, and you are essentially frozen (and vulnerable -- though there are some caveats to that) during it. Ditto for your enemies. You might not have consciously noticed it, but basically every game you've ever played has allowed you to interrupt yourself mid-movement and do another action instead. Therefore, Souls games really require you to think before you do something. One reason people are so "hardcore" about these games is because they truly are games of skill.

R1 is your fast attack, R2 your slower but more powerful attack. Really take note of the timing. Long, isn't it?

It's slightly different in every game, but in ER Y or Triangle, and then R1 or L1, will make your right or left weapon two-handed. Your R1 and R2 attacks will be a bit more powerful. Also, press L2 (and depending on the weapon, follow that up with R1 or R2), and you'll get your "special" attack that's only available while two-handing. There's a lot of finesse in figuring out when to do what, but for now, just stick with R1 and R2 (one- and/or two-handed), and get the feel for combat. It might take a little bit, and don't be afraid to look stuff up. Trust me, the effort is rewarded here, truly.

Push the right control stick to lock on to an enemy. It took me ages to figure this out, and was the number one thing that started to make the game feel good. With time I've come to see it with more nuance -- sometimes it's good to lock, sometimes not (particularly when facing a lot of enemies), but at first I'd pretty much keep it on all the time while fighting. Notice that if you jerk your left controller, the lock will move from one enemy to another. Learning how to quickly switch locks between enemies is a huge help.

Hold B or Circle to run. Tap it to roll. These two actions are key to the Souls genre. Rolling is everything in combat. Getting a feel for when to speed up (especially when circling an enemy) is also huge. You are briefly invincible while rolling -- learning to time a roll through an enemy's attack is a key component of these games.

Jumping is quite different and more of a main mechanic in ER, whereas in former Souls games it was easily the most cludgy control (and therefore one of the least important movements). Just like rolling, you're invincible for a few frames while jumping.

Rolling and jumping into an attack makes the attack more powerful.

There's lots more: parrying, back stabs, critical hits, plus weapons scaling with your stats, magic...but for now, the bread and butter above should be all that matters. Move and hit with grace/speed/thought.

Regarding the visuals, I simply could not disagree more. A common refrain about From's games is that, while yes, they're never on the bleeding edge in terms of graphics quality, their art design is second to none, and I absolutely agree with that sentiment. It's just the best there is. They definitely have a "look," and their characters especially have this really particular, slightly janky look, but that's part of the charm. The world, though...honestly best in class, consistently. Their art direction and atmosphere is just incredible. Personally I'm finding ER lacking compared to DS3 and Bloodborne (though ER does have a few absolutely jaw-dropping moments), but it makes up for that in other ways. Also, it's a massive, open world -- it can't be expected to be blowing me away as much as a more linear, closed, and thus composed game like DS3 or Bloodborne.

Yes, the software quality is bad right now (sounds like you're on PC?) but this is unfortunately par for the course early on with PC games in general. It always takes a sec to iron out the bugs. I just got an update tonight and it helped a ton, only had one frame stutter in about 3 hours. Also be sure to update your GPU drivers.

Dialogue: these are high fantasy RPGs, they're gothic and can be over the top and are quite dramatic. If you don't like that, I highly doubt you'll like the games, full stop. That said, boy, I could not disagree more regarding "poor level design." From's level design is quite simply the best in the business.

I think you misunderstood the "ghost" -- that was probably above the "tutorial cave," if I'm reading what you're saying correctly. From's games famously don't really have tutorials, so ER having one is a bit odd. I took the whole "the door's clearly right over there, but go jump in this hole real quick anyway" type thing as a cheeky, typical From humor way of saying "tutorials are a bit crude no matter what so we're gonna literally stick it down in a hole." I suppose if you're new to From's humor it might not land, but then again I wouldn't suggest ER as a first From game anyway.

Multiplayer being a "cheap gimmick" seems a bit harsh and odd wording. What part of it is a "gimmick?" That said, I personally prefer to play the games offline, so I'm with you there. The messages are hilarious and the bloodstains can be useful, but overall I like to feel left alone on my first play through. Later on I can play online to inject some fun and variety.

Re: Hidetaka Miyazaki sees death as a feature, not a bug

#99
post #30
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just my own opinions to respond to a couple of your points: - Visuals: Disappointing. Looked like a cheap free-to-play MMO. Cheap-looking textures, stock-looking characters What settings did you have the game on? This has never been my experience with a Souls game - and definitely not Elden Ring. - bad rigging (e.g. characters holding things in unnatural poses), etc. Yeah, agree. Pretty typical for every game though.…

> What settings did you have the game on? 1440p "high" on 3060 Ti. My visual objections weren't just the low-quality lighting, textures, framerate cap, etc. (objectively kind of bad) but also the visual design of the game (which I thought was kind of tacky/garish and reminiscent of 2010-era low-budget multiplayer games). > Pretty typical for every game though. I saw some stuff that looked really out-of-place in an AA…

> The multiplayer didn't feel like an integral part of the game.

That's because it's not. These are not "multiplayer games" like CoD or Smash. These are single player games with some online/multiplayer elements.

> the random ghosts popping up all over the place (I think part of multiplayer?) seemed useless and distracting

Those pop up when you touch "bloodstains," i.e. seeing what other players did that caused them to die. Farthest thing from useless, actually -- they've saved my ass many times.

Re: Hidetaka Miyazaki sees death as a feature, not a bug

#100
post #78
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> FromSoft has always been a step behind from a graphical fidelity level. But they make up for it in art design, which is some of the best in the industry. I'm not just talking about lack of rendering bells and whistles - I also thought the design itself was tacky, reminiscent of much lower-budget games like Valheim or those mid-2010s f2p Korean MMOs. Admittedly this is subjective. > For the controls, the game is all…

Lack of rendering 'bells and whistles'? That statement doesn't mean anything, what bells and whistles? It looks like a mid-2010s f2p Korean MMO? what planet are you on. I cant believe I replied to this nonsense.

I love the game but I'm not sure what you are not getting? It is a pretty mediocre looking game in terms of graphics tech at least. Horizon Forbidden West came out at the same time and it looks like it was made on another planet compared to Elden Ring.
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