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Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

reuters.com

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Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#271

Post by weaksauce »

trhway wrote: post #242
munificent wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As a healthy 30 year old I would prefer to take my risk with covid than take these vaccines. Unfortunate that you're also unilaterally forcing everyone you come into contact with to take that same risk if you are infected without realizing it.

> everyone you come into contact with to take that same risk how come so if those "everyone" got vaccinated? I mean all the risk groups who has clearly higher risk from covid than vaccine should definitely go for vaccine. The rest - personal choice of risk. And as a healthy 49 years old, i'm taking my chance with covid and have no plans for vaccination (i was always laughing at anti-vaxxers, yet seeing all misinforma…

> And as a healthy 49 years old, i'm taking my chance with covid and have no plans for vaccination

so you would rather be at between a 1 in 500 and a 1 in 250 risk of dying in your age group + a much higher risk than that of some long covid symptoms that are debilitating/unknown if they will ever get better vs. a 1 in a 1,000,000 chance you get something that might be bad but is likely survivable... I don't understand the anti-vaxxer "logic"

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#272

Post by daenz »

seaman1921 wrote: post #215
kybernetyk wrote: post #190

This means it’s working.

the point is - it should be studied whether this is causing any permanent heart damage

We shouldn't study things like that because it will only be used to support antivaxxer arguments /s

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#273

Post by eganist »

0-_-0 wrote: post #262
eganist wrote: post #259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, reading the discussion/conclusion via google translate, this seems to be a study on metabolism of the vaccine? Open to being fact-checked, but this doesn't seem related. In any case, the only statement I found on health effects in the discussion/conclusion was "No toxic findings indicating liver damage were found in the rat repeated-dose toxicity test ( M2.6.6.3 )." but I don't speak Japanese and I'm sure usi…

What I belive this might show (still trying to figure this out) is how the lipid nanoparticles from the vaccine are distributed in the body. Page 7 shows particularly high concentration in the ovaries for example. I think the idea of the vaccine should be that the intramuscular injection stays in the muscle and the spike proteins don't get into your blood, but this was never actually directly verified. What this stud…

Given the sheer volume of doses delivered and the capability to detect clotting risks (az, JJ), the fact that clotting risk did not go up with biontech and moderna might throw a wrench into that hunch.

But even then, not seeing an indication of risk within two orders of magnitude of covid itself.

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#274

Post by trhway »

eganist wrote: post #260
trhway wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> everyone you come into contact with to take that same risk how come so if those "everyone" got vaccinated? I mean all the risk groups who has clearly higher risk from covid than vaccine should definitely go for vaccine. The rest - personal choice of risk. And as a healthy 49 years old, i'm taking my chance with covid and have no plans for vaccination (i was always laughing at anti-vaxxers, yet seeing all misinforma…

> (i was always laughing at anti-vaxxers, yet seeing all misinformation and propaganda (the smell of USSR strength propaganda is just overwhelming) around covid i think i'll pass this one) No, you weren't. A common false-flag ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_flag ) attack involves presenting oneself as a member of an opposing viewpoint in order to find adherents for the desired viewpoint. The tell is your use of…

>The tell is your use of the words "misinformation" and "propaganda." People who tend to levy such claims also tend to share more of it

you said it yourself. It is kind of ironically not surprising that you levied the above mentioned claim and actually posted the misinformation and propaganda yourself - see below.

>No, you weren't.

you really don't know, yet you're making with complete confidence such a completely false blatantly contradicting facts[0] statement just because it suits your narrative

>A common false-flag ...

and helps you to advance your agenda. Thus your post is a clear example of misinformation and propaganda. Not sure that you're doing it intentionally, probably you're just caught up in that mob hysteria.

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8860543

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#275

Post by drknownuffin »

thebean11 wrote: post #30
delecti wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Crude rate seems to be observed cases per million doses administered. So a lot more incidents than expected, but still extremely rare (0.002% of doses). Edit: missed an extra "0" in that percent, thanks for the the catch everyone who did

But it's only been a few months since administration, will the gap between expected and actual keep growing, or will they eventually level out?

Post-viral myocarditis / pericarditis usually occurs in the days to weeks (up to about a month, generally) following a viral infection.

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#276

Post by cma »

sjg007 wrote: post #202
EMM_386 wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How long do spike proteins (SARS-CoV-2 or vaccine created) hang out if they make it to the heart? As far as I understand it, the vaccine doesn't work like this. It tells your immune system "hey this is what a SARS-CoV-2 spike protein looks like, attack it if you see it". So the vaccine wouldn't cause the heart damage, the vaccine does (intentionally) ramp up your immune system to learn about this new threat, which…

The covid spike protein binds ace2 so the immune response to bind the spike could bind ace2 as well. Normally this is mitigated by a self selection filter but it is not out of the question that you could develop an autoimmune response.

The spike protien binds to ace2 receptors, so the immune response may be more likely to bind to ACE2, which also binds to ace2 receptors, but that isn't a given because the part on the spile the immune response targets don't have to themselves match with parts of ACE2.

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#278

Post by lowdest »

nicoburns wrote: post #113
mrfusion wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

COVID induced myocarditis has been thoroughly disproven: https://www.statnews.com/2021/05/14/setting-the-record-strai...

Based on my personal experience, I'm pretty skeptical of this. I'm 28, healthy (or was previously), and have never previously had any issues with my heart. Got covid last April which came with quite sharp heart pain which seemed to match up very well to descriptions of myocarditis on and off for about 6 months. And I'm only just now getting to the point now where a raised heart beat isn't painful. You might say it's…

10 years ago I had diagnosed pericarditis from a viral infection. I had Covid in 2020 which caused a similar chest pain during elevated heart rate, it slowly resolved over a few months.

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#279

Post by Talanes »

eganist wrote: post #260
trhway wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> everyone you come into contact with to take that same risk how come so if those "everyone" got vaccinated? I mean all the risk groups who has clearly higher risk from covid than vaccine should definitely go for vaccine. The rest - personal choice of risk. And as a healthy 49 years old, i'm taking my chance with covid and have no plans for vaccination (i was always laughing at anti-vaxxers, yet seeing all misinforma…

> (i was always laughing at anti-vaxxers, yet seeing all misinformation and propaganda (the smell of USSR strength propaganda is just overwhelming) around covid i think i'll pass this one) No, you weren't. A common false-flag ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_flag ) attack involves presenting oneself as a member of an opposing viewpoint in order to find adherents for the desired viewpoint. The tell is your use of…

Responding to skepticism with hostility does nothing except make you feel better. And further convince the skeptics that you're wrong. After all, if you'll try to tell them that their own lived experience is a lie, why should they believe anything you tell them?

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#280

Post by IG_Semmelweiss »

eganist wrote: post #174
drcross wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>which is what Covid binds to. You mean the SARS-2 spike protein binds to the ACE receptors. mRNA vaccines create the spike protein so it's going to work in exactly the same way as natural infection. Recent research from Japan is showing that the spike protein from vaccination is not staying at the injection site it can get into the blood stream (and causes blood clots as are widely reported), crossing the blood brai…

> I've done enough research to know what I'm talking about The standard practice is for those making the assertion to provide their references or data. Since you've done the research, can you please link any published and peer reviewed research establishing that the health risks from the vaccine are within two orders of magnitude of the health risks from the virus? Including morbidity, mortality, etc. > The smartest…

He is wrong to make such a claim without data.

However, absense of evidence is not evidence of absense, either.

The simple truth is that there hasnt been enough time to really understand the long term effects of covid, or the vaccine.

Anyone claiming otherwise is simply lying.

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