The Awkward but Essential Art of Office Chitchat • Hacker News Board

Re: The Awkward but Essential Art of Office Chitchat

#141

Post by lonelappde » Mon, Sep 23, 2019, 4:13 PM UTC

fibbery wrote: post #132

coldtea wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> While this 'say what you see' served as a functional ice-breaker, as an introvert I found it strangely confrontational, almost like an interrogation On the other hand, why see "introvert" or "extrovert" as something that you essentially are, and not an accidental attribute, one can, and perhaps should, work on? In that case, his 'say what you see' routine would be a good testing ground to stop caring as much for th…

Are extroverts supposed to work on it too?

If they are suffering from lack of attention, sure.

Re: The Awkward but Essential Art of Office Chitchat

#142

Post by lonelappde » Mon, Sep 23, 2019, 4:14 PM UTC

TurkishPoptart wrote: post #136

breakbread wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For whatever reason, I can stand when people comment on what I've brought for lunch. "Hey, that looks pretty good!""Smells good! What'cha got there?""Bring me some next time!"

For one reason or another, I've developed a sort of office-eating-phobia. There was a period where, in order to feel OK and not pass out at my desk, I packed a tupperware container with Greek yogurt and almond butter. I think it tastes amazing, kind of like cheesecake, and with the high-fat/high-protein content, keeps me satisfied for 4 hours, so I don't have to think about lunch til 2-3pm, and even then I could just…

Is agreeing with someone's compliment the hardest part of your job? And are you hiring?

Re: The Awkward but Essential Art of Office Chitchat

#143

Post by oillio » Mon, Sep 23, 2019, 4:18 PM UTC

pgt wrote: post #73

mruts wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the best way to make coworkers friends is to talk about drugs you’ve done. Now that you have mutual comprimate it will be very difficult for one of you to fuck the other without it backfiring. Another good way is to hang out with the smokers, even if you don’t smoke. I’ve noticed that people smoking together is a nexus of power, especially if a higher up or the CEO does it.

Beware of doing this, as it can easily backfire when abused by HR. Stick to exchanging stories that could not be deemed to have an impact on your job, or explain bad performance.

That defeats the point of the exercise. The fact that the information could be damaging is what makes it powerful.

Re: The Awkward but Essential Art of Office Chitchat

#144

Post by twoquestions » Mon, Sep 23, 2019, 4:29 PM UTC

asdfman123 wrote: post #125

twoquestions wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except the incentives are aligned to be a Hobbesian war of all against all. There is no incentive to collaborate or team up at all. Ever wonder why shows like Survivor and Battle Royale games are so popular? That's how office life is these days. Nobody is ever "in your corner" as you put it. Everyone is always and forever trying to gut everyone else in a neverending zero sum game. Unless you work in a new/high growth…

Maybe there's an argument that if you go full Machiavelli you can rise higher in the corporate world, but what's the point? Sure, I could become the Senior VP of Whatever, but that won't make me happy, and sacrificing my personal values will make me unhappy. Furthermore, I learned the value of collaboration, even if it helps potential opponents, through the card game Puerto Rico. Trading with others helps them, but i…

WRT Puerto Rico, I've actually been wanting a game like that for a while, I'll have to get it. Thanks for the recommendation!

Re: The Awkward but Essential Art of Office Chitchat

#145

Post by coldtea » Mon, Sep 23, 2019, 4:35 PM UTC

fibbery wrote: post #132

coldtea wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> While this 'say what you see' served as a functional ice-breaker, as an introvert I found it strangely confrontational, almost like an interrogation On the other hand, why see "introvert" or "extrovert" as something that you essentially are, and not an accidental attribute, one can, and perhaps should, work on? In that case, his 'say what you see' routine would be a good testing ground to stop caring as much for th…

Are extroverts supposed to work on it too?

Sure. Excess in most directions is not very good for others and for one's self...

Re: The Awkward but Essential Art of Office Chitchat

#146

Post by jbarberu » Mon, Sep 23, 2019, 4:56 PM UTC

coldtea wrote: post #113

feintruled wrote: post #57

It can be quite a minefield. I worked with a guy whose chit-chat policy was disconcerting - stating the bleedin' obvious. "You are in early today!" "You are in late today!" "You are on time today!" "Wearing the red shirt again, I see!" "Got your hair cut!" While this 'say what you see' served as a functional ice-breaker, as an introvert I found it strangely confrontational, almost like an interrogation. I felt like I…

> While this 'say what you see' served as a functional ice-breaker, as an introvert I found it strangely confrontational, almost like an interrogation On the other hand, why see "introvert" or "extrovert" as something that you essentially are, and not an accidental attribute, one can, and perhaps should, work on? In that case, his 'say what you see' routine would be a good testing ground to stop caring as much for th…

I would say it's something you should work _with_ not _on_. Being introverted means you gain your energy from time alone and you typically drain energy in social settings. It doesn't mean you can't function around others, but that your alone-time is not optional.

Learning that about myself and figuring out how to work with that has made life a lot easier.

Re: The Awkward but Essential Art of Office Chitchat

#147

Post by TurkishPoptart » Mon, Sep 23, 2019, 5:07 PM UTC

lonelappde wrote: post #142

TurkishPoptart wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For one reason or another, I've developed a sort of office-eating-phobia. There was a period where, in order to feel OK and not pass out at my desk, I packed a tupperware container with Greek yogurt and almond butter. I think it tastes amazing, kind of like cheesecake, and with the high-fat/high-protein content, keeps me satisfied for 4 hours, so I don't have to think about lunch til 2-3pm, and even then I could just…

Is agreeing with someone's compliment the hardest part of your job? And are you hiring?

Yes, it actually is. I'm just a temp. I'm flattered that you asked that, but I'm in no position to hire anyone; I'm a deadbeat Slavophile trying to masquerade as an IT expert.

Re: The Awkward but Essential Art of Office Chitchat

#148

Post by FiatLuxDave » Mon, Sep 23, 2019, 5:32 PM UTC

flycaliguy wrote: post #104

gexla wrote: post #50

Smalltalk is improv. It's yes... and. You take turns with the hot potato. You take your turn and then pass it. It's creating a story. Take whatever what was passed to you, add something quirky and then pass it back. It's fun to add something off the wall, a bit ridiculous. Doing this takes courage. You WILL make mistakes. At times, you may cringe at yourself. Putting yourself out there, taking small risks is the spic…

Probably my most upvoted repeat HN comments are my recommendations of the book Impro by Keith Johnstone. It really is a brilliant breakdown of what Improv is beyond theatre games. I think it’s especially useful for coders in the workplace because it really nails the importance of understanding exchanges of “status” in these situations. So much of humour is building and then diminishing a person’s status in an artful…

FYI, I bought the book and read it due to your HN comments. Thank you for making me aware of it.

Re: The Awkward but Essential Art of Office Chitchat

#149

Post by Red29 » Mon, Sep 23, 2019, 5:42 PM UTC

flycaliguy wrote: post #104

gexla wrote: post #50

Smalltalk is improv. It's yes... and. You take turns with the hot potato. You take your turn and then pass it. It's creating a story. Take whatever what was passed to you, add something quirky and then pass it back. It's fun to add something off the wall, a bit ridiculous. Doing this takes courage. You WILL make mistakes. At times, you may cringe at yourself. Putting yourself out there, taking small risks is the spic…

Probably my most upvoted repeat HN comments are my recommendations of the book Impro by Keith Johnstone. It really is a brilliant breakdown of what Improv is beyond theatre games. I think it’s especially useful for coders in the workplace because it really nails the importance of understanding exchanges of “status” in these situations. So much of humour is building and then diminishing a person’s status in an artful…

Yes. I have been doing improvisation now every week for past 3-4 years. And impro is definitely the best book I have read on the subject.

Re: The Awkward but Essential Art of Office Chitchat

#150

Post by RugnirViking » Mon, Sep 23, 2019, 5:52 PM UTC

twoquestions wrote: post #91

war1025 wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like a wild place to work at. Also sounds like a great way to end up isolated and alone. Even at work, you sometimes need people in your corner.

Except the incentives are aligned to be a Hobbesian war of all against all. There is no incentive to collaborate or team up at all. Ever wonder why shows like Survivor and Battle Royale games are so popular? That's how office life is these days. Nobody is ever "in your corner" as you put it. Everyone is always and forever trying to gut everyone else in a neverending zero sum game. Unless you work in a new/high growth…

I'm fascinated to see if you just work in bizzare confrontational companies or are just paranoid. Pretty much everywhere I've been I've gotten on well with my coworkers, chatted about videogames, beer, gone to various resturants for lunch, and generally enjoyed myself. To do anything else would seem almost unbearable - and this comes from a 100% introvert.

There are subtle signals that people have to both recognise and/or know how to use in order to use smalltalk succesfully - things like never interrupt someone wearing headphones on both ears, or recognising body language of someone absorbed by thought.

Even if you genuinely don't ever like talking to people, they are bound to get the message soon enough and stop trying. And if for some reason they have the spectacularly bad social skills to not pick that up, usually telling them once or twice (kindly!) that you don't like to chat at work should get them to stop.