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Angela Merkel’s record on environmental policy has been a disaster

theguardian.com

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Re: Angela Merkel’s record on environmental policy has been a disaster

#81

Post by busemann »

dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #71
lispm wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's actually the opposite of the perception of Angela Merkel in Germany. In Germany she is seen as populist, because she changes her mind quite often or waits until the public opinion is clear. Only in the refugee crisis, she was seen as following moral principles having not made any concessions to right wing politics (which earned her a lot of respect and a lot of hate). Make no mistake, generally her team is ver…

> she was seen as following moral principles having not made any concessions to right wing politics Well, Bavarians might disagree with both "moral principles" and "right wing". Especially CDU is hardly "right wing".

Our Marxist-Leninist party in Germany has recently put up election posters that read "Rechtsruck der Regierung stoppen!" - basically "Stop the government's swing to the right!".

I really have no idea what they are talking about, considering our "conservative" government ruling party is now pushing far-left open border policies, unlimited migrant and refugee intake, gay marriage recently passed under their government and they implemented minimum wage laws. The CDU has never moved as far left before as they are right now.

Re: Angela Merkel’s record on environmental policy has been a disaster

#82

Post by ZeroGravitas »

Ntrails wrote: post #74
Grue3 wrote: post #49

IMO being anti-nuclear and pro-environment are mutually exclusive positions. Easy way to discern who really wants to reduce carbon emissions and who is just a populist.

It is incredibly telling to me that the article doesn't even mention the nuclear issue because, i assume, the author is afraid of that reality. Coal is going to have to be a backbone because nuclear got killed. Pick your poison please, but be honest that that was the choice made.

The author is pro-nuclear:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/sep/15/nuclea...

"Nuclear power, whatever its detractors might claim, is a low-carbon energy source, roughly comparable to renewables in terms of total emissions. To shut down viable nuclear capacity in the midst of a climate change emergency (now, in other words), as Germany and Japan have done, is a refined form of madness, especially when at least some of that capacity is likely to be replaced by gas or coal, whose carbon emissions are much higher. Replacing fossil fuels with renewables, on the timescale in which we need to act, is hard enough, without setting yourself the additional, unnecessary challenge of also replacing nuclear power."

Re: Angela Merkel’s record on environmental policy has been a disaster

#83

Post by MagnumOpus »

LoSboccacc wrote: post #52
guitarbill wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> other countries call it corruption, in Germany is called corporatism. That's insulting, and factually inaccurate - unless you have evidence to substantiate this hyperbole? > for example, the way the Greek crisis was managed The Greek crisis had other origins, and the financial checks/obligations upon joining the Euro are supposed to mitigate against the risk of not being able to devalue a national currency to e.g.…

> The Greek crisis had other origins, and the financial checks/obligations upon joining the Euro are supposed to mitigate against the risk of not being able to devalue a national currency to e.g. boost tourism or exports. Too bad the Greek financial records may have not been completely accurate. Guess who pushed hard and voiched for greece joining the euro?

That would be Valerie Giscard-d'Estaing who twisted arms to get Greece into the EEC and Mitterrand who forced through the Euro.

If you are trying to insinuate that this was a German plot, you couldn't be farther from the truth. The Deutsche Mark was a sacred cow and getting rid of it in favour of a common currency with "irresponsible countries" with weak currencies was deeply unpopular even with internationalists like Kohl. Only France threatening to block German reunification unless they drop the Mark, in 1990, got German politicians to agree to giving up their currency.

Re: Angela Merkel’s record on environmental policy has been a disaster

#84

Post by cygx »

guitarbill wrote: post #12
_Codemonkeyism wrote: post #3

Basically Germany will miss the goal of a 40% reduction by 2020 with only reducing CO2 by 30%. Beside coal/gas power, mostly from closing nuclear power plants. For example a quarter of CO2 emission in Berlin is coming from two Vattenfall coal power plants. Other effects are larger increase in people and economic growth. I have been buying renewable energy for 15 years, but not many/not enough people in Germany care.…

This largely coincides with the Green Party's rise in popularity. Sadly it seems they have no real plan, only ideology. IMO this is why they've prioritised shutting down nuclear power over coal power, because demonstrating against nuclear power is almost required to be a member, but sensible policies are not. I don't think you can blame Merkel, she doesn't really have a hard stance on most topics - if anything, the o…

the popularity of Martin Schulz

That's a good one!

Re: Angela Merkel’s record on environmental policy has been a disaster

#85

Post by zurn »

lispm wrote: post #11
kome wrote: post #5

Very good article. The industry-government nexus in Germany is indeed super powerful and underrated: other countries call it corruption, in Germany is called corporatism. In the last few years we saw it in action, with important repercussion on the global level: for example, the way the Greek crisis was managed it had to do much more with the safety of German banks, that with the welfare of Greece ( https://www.esmt.…

Without European (and incl. German) money Greece would be bancrupt and no longer in the Eurozone. Bancrupt banks in Europe would have helped no one, particularly not Greece. For the welfare of the people in Greece the greek government is responsible, not Angela Merkel.

The bankruptcy scenario was always highly unlikely, the banks would have been bailed out with tax money. Just like they were bailed out with tax money in actual history, just with another name (loans to the Greek government, who gave the money back to the unwisely lending EU banks).

Re: Angela Merkel’s record on environmental policy has been a disaster

#86

Post by shangxiao »

qf303rjr3 wrote: post #42
shangxiao wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like jabs at conservative politics are the norm now with a lot of journalism. A few weeks back an article [1] I read, from reddit, started with: …the dastardly Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor seem to be a great gift to the Alt-Right’s xenophobic nationalists. Interesting article, but unnecessary (and daresay incorrect?) jab at the start. [1] http://www.thedailybeast.com/the-american-who-buried-a-kamik...

If you're going to quote an article, you shouldn't leave out context that changes the meaning of the sentence you're quoting - "The 75th anniversary commemorations of the dastardly Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor seem to be a great gift to the Alt-Right’s xenophobic nationalists." It's the 75th anniversary commemorations that seem to be a gift - not the attack itself (obviously).

Ah yes you're quite right! Apologies to all. I'd misread that, although I think my point still stands: I'd like to read about the story and not hear about politics in a foreign (to me) country.

Re: Angela Merkel’s record on environmental policy has been a disaster

#87

Post by qznc »

wink wrote: post #47
guitarbill wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm from Baden Württemberg, and I'm not sure how strong the car industry is any more. For example, every year a bit more autobahn has a speed restriction applied to it. I think you're spot on though. The diesel emissions scandal is made worse by the fact that diesel was promoted in the EU because the CO2 emissions tend to be lower than petrol. This is reflected by diesel vs petrol prices in France or Germany (diesel…

Where do you get this rise from? 2009 - 10.7% 2013 - 8.4% 2017 - 8-10% (projections) Only B-W has a ruling Green Party, I'd they they're still mostly at 10% everywhere else.

Living in Baden-Württemberg is probably the reason. Green is the strongest party there (2016 30%). They are ahead of CDU (Merkels party) for two periods now.

Re: Angela Merkel’s record on environmental policy has been a disaster

#88

Post by shangxiao »

matt4077 wrote: post #69
shangxiao wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like jabs at conservative politics are the norm now with a lot of journalism. A few weeks back an article [1] I read, from reddit, started with: …the dastardly Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor seem to be a great gift to the Alt-Right’s xenophobic nationalists. Interesting article, but unnecessary (and daresay incorrect?) jab at the start. [1] http://www.thedailybeast.com/the-american-who-buried-a-kamik...

The wrong form of the verb 'seem' in that sentence betrays your incredibly dishonest attempt at selective quoting.

By the time I'd realised my mistake I couldn't delete or edit the comment.

Re: Angela Merkel’s record on environmental policy has been a disaster

#89

Post by _ph_ »

guitarbill wrote: post #14
dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Electric ground transportation is the future. It's a relatively less evil, for now. We still haven't found a good way of dealing with old batteries and it's a huge environmental problem.

Do hydrogen fuel cells have major issues, other than the chicken-and-egg problem of hydrogen refueling stations?

Hydrogen fuel cells use about 3x the electric energy vs. battery powered cars, if you create hydrogen via hydrolysis. It is not only the energy used for creating the hydrogen, but also the compression and transport of the hydrogen is using a lot of energy.

Re: Angela Merkel’s record on environmental policy has been a disaster

#90

Post by mixedbit »

ahartmetz wrote: post #65
mixedbit wrote: post #33

I fail to understand why German automotive industry is lobbing pro diesels. All German car makers make both gasoline and diesel engines, if diesels were banned or taxed to be more expensive customers wouldn't resign from buying cars but would choose some other available option (gasoline, hybrid, electric).

I think it's because they have a technical edge (well...) in diesel engines for cars and / or because they sell so many of them, especially in Germany itself. Markets favoring diesel engines thus favor German car makers.

I wonder if the technical edge is there only because German diesels do not meet emission regulations. It is easy to have the best product on the market if all the competitors need to make weaker engines to meet the regulations and German companies make a cheating software instead.
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