The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May • Hacker News Board

Re: The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

#541

Post by pests » Tue, Apr 28, 2020, 2:43 AM UTC

oppositelock wrote: post #235

bobthepanda wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not aware of any lockdowns which are specifically targeted at small retailers while competing large retailers are allowed to be open. Where I am the small coffee shops are closed for walk-in business, but so are the Starbucks; the difference is that small coffee shops are not able to pivot to a centralized delivery platform en masse the way Starbucks is.

I can speak to a few examples specifically. It's planting season now, and high business for nurseries. In Santa Clara County, they're closed by fiat. Lowe's, Home Depot, ACE hardware sell essential things (plumbing supplies, etc), so they get to remain open, in-store nurseries and all. So, if I want tomatoes, I have to brave the crowds at Lowe's instead of hopping out to my local nursery which is rarely densely popul…

This is hilarious to me. In Michigan big box stores can't sell garden items or seeds. You can still get them from any other retailer that was open. People were protesting.

Re: The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

#542

Post by twoodfin » Tue, Apr 28, 2020, 2:43 AM UTC

ojbyrne wrote: post #519

twoodfin wrote: post #472

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there a single state in the US that has not waived the “active job search” requirement for unemployment benefits at this point?

https://www.natlawreview.com/article/employers-and-workers-i... Says most states. Without much searching I found at least 3 (AK,WA and CA).

CA is currently requiring the unemployed to be actively seeking work to receive benefits? That can’t be right.

Re: The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

#543

Post by koyote » Tue, Apr 28, 2020, 2:46 AM UTC

filoleg wrote: post #279

ultrarunner wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I intentionally moved from reddit to HN after this same specific realization. After a few years it seemed like reddit would be a good place for hyper local info on covid, but I quickly saw the same effect— misanthropy in the face of so many people trying to do the best they could for others during hard times. It’s off topic here, but I seriously wonder what specifically caused reddit to adopt the largely toxic cultur…

My guess for the main reason Reddit feels so toxic would be younger demographic whose primary concern is demonstrating how much "smarter" they are than an average person. The commenting guidelines are also super lax, and the topics covered are very diverse. Which is mostly the opposite of HN, which skews older and actually more educated, comment guidelines are much stricter, and the topics covered are much more techn…

I think the upvoting mechanism is quite a large differentiator as well.

Upvotes should be for 'contributes to discussion' not for 'I agree'. But it's universally used an agreement/disagreement button on Reddit which amplifies the hivemind massively.

That plus the fact that downvoting is only granted once you've spent a considerable amount of time participating in the community can have a huge impact on the nature of discussions.

Re: The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

#544

Post by sneak » Tue, Apr 28, 2020, 2:50 AM UTC

ikiris wrote: post #522

exhilaration wrote: post #316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reddit. My state's subreddit has a massive discussion about how the unemployment system is failing, completely unable to handle the enormous number of people trying to file claims. There's a lot of desperation in those threads.

They have a great opportunity to make things better come Nov now that they've been affected by the failling.

Many of those people will have already been evicted by February.

Re: The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

#545

Post by streb-lo » Tue, Apr 28, 2020, 2:50 AM UTC

epa wrote: post #501

esoterica wrote: post #485

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I remember RON PAUL 2008 and the unironic fedora wearing and I don't miss what it used to be.

I remember pun threads and intelligent discourse - prior to the ron paul days (post-digg).

Digg was around and bigger than Reddit until 2010.

Re: The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

#546

Post by syedkarim » Tue, Apr 28, 2020, 2:51 AM UTC

_xnmw wrote: post #323

hombre_fatal wrote: post #4

I'm lucky enough to have remote work. And I'm sure many HNers have a nice buffer of savings from their tech jobs to weather the storm or are getting paid time off. But can anyone share what it's like to not be in either of these situations? How are your rent lords handling things? I live abroad in a cheap country so I can handle zero income, but I wouldn't be able to last long if rent was $2000+/mo instead of the Yet…

Where on earth are you paying $200/mo for rent?

I lived in Puryear, Tennessee for about a year. One-bedroom apartment/1000 square feet was $325 a month.

Re: The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

#547

Post by in_cahoots » Tue, Apr 28, 2020, 2:51 AM UTC

urban_strike wrote: post #514

jwlake wrote: post #482

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing I'm confused by is why a costco is open that has like 1000 people per day and a flower shop that has 20 customers per day isn't open. Is the flower shop dangerous? Is it less essential on the yearly timeframe? This lockdown isn't measured in days right now, it's measured in months. What's "essential" in days is not what's "essential" in months.

Flowers aren't consumed for survival, i.e. "essential". I'm not sure how intervals of time has any effect on that.

Shouldn’t the metric incorporate the risk each activity entails? A good example is gardeners. Gardeners work alone or in teams of two, can obey social distancing, and generally don’t even talk to their clients on a regular basis. What is the threat here? What is so magical about the word essential? On the flip side large alcohol stores like Bevmo can stay open and serve hundreds of customers a day because they sell cheese and crackers and somehow that makes them ‘essential’.

It doesn’t make any sense, unless the true goal is enforcement through fear and propaganda. Disrupt people’s lives enough and they’ll start to think that the alternative must be truly terrible. That’s why you get articles claiming that even young people are susceptible where the simple math shows that the risk is low. Cherry-picked stories about the handful of children who died from the virus, instead of articles about the kids going hungry because they can’t get two free meals a day. It’s fear-mongering as public policy.

Re: The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

#548

Post by holler » Tue, Apr 28, 2020, 2:53 AM UTC

jackcosgrove wrote: post #532

greendave wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not that SIP does nothing - it's that past a certain point, the rates are what they are. San Mateo and Santa Clara counties have seen a slight increase in the number of cases last week over the previous week. Other Bay Area counties have seen a slight decrease [1]. I don't see how increased traffic/travel as we're starting to see [2] will do anything other than increase transmissions. [1] https://projects.sfchro…

I thought the purpose of SIP orders was to prevent overwhelming hospital ICUs. Covid case numbers are upstream of that but it's not 1-1.

That was/is the precise reason given, so it's hard to imagine this going on much longer given that hospitals are doing fine. I think another month is going to lead to chaos and many people rebelling.

Re: The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

#549

Post by weq » Tue, Apr 28, 2020, 2:53 AM UTC

mynameishere wrote: post #523

jliptzin wrote: post #498

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yea I am wondering the same thing. I am REALLY lucky to have saved a lot and be in a good living situation where I can quarantine comfortably. But what the hell are people doing who were paycheck to paycheck? I would not blame them if they had to start stealing from supermarkets

REALLY lucky to have saved a lot Luck might play a role in whether you got a good job, but saving money is mostly a product of willpower. I would not blame them if they had to start stealing from supermarkets Would you blame them if they stole $15/pound steak instead of $0.20/pound bags of flour? Because few people steal bags of flour--that is, few people steal food for purposes of preventing starvation. It's mostly…

Desperation?

People dont do bad things because they want to be bad or lazy. Thats Nixon era properganda used marginalise the anti-war hippies in favour of the Military Industrial Complex.

Conversatives will trumpet this till the cows come home while simultatiously gouging the govenrment with there large businiess for subsidies, discounts, monopolistic laws, on everything they do.

You could pay entire swaths of your population unemployment, or you could subsidies the creation of a new oil processing facility and let that company then employ the population. When you subsidise big buisness, that money goes straight into family trusts. When you subsidise people directly, that money goes straight back into the community.

As soon as u pay people a basic income, they have the chance todo what they want in life. People dont want to steal. They only start doing that once they are disenfrancised and already marginalised.

Re: The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

#550

Post by paxys » Tue, Apr 28, 2020, 2:55 AM UTC

maxerickson wrote: post #387

cs702 wrote: post #71

If many people get very sick simultaneously, they would not only overwhelm hospitals, they would also inflict a disorderly, involuntary shutdown of large swaths of the economy, driven by fear -- instead of the orderly, voluntary shutdown we have at present, driven by government mandate. We all want to avoid that .

There seem to be lots of people that think actual chaos is the only sufficient justification for a shutdown. No averting anything, let it get bad and mop up afterwords.

There's always that chunk of the population who will grumble about taking precautions and then go "see, nothing happened!"