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Tesla Delivers Record 97,000 Vehicles in Q3

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Re: Tesla Delivers Record 97,000 Vehicles in Q3

#181

Post by mc32 »

thethrowboat wrote: post #149
et2o wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People have been making that exact argument for years. There have been so many "Tesla killers" that I've lost count. None have panned out. The Taycan is roughly twice as expensive as the equivalent Model S Tesla and has greatly inferior range and, among people likely to buy electric cars, presumably less brand value. People haven't forgotten VW's emissions scandal. Let's not forget they haven't even shipped a single…

Atleast in Europe i3 is selling almost as well as all Tesla models together. http://carsalesbase.com/car-sales-comparison/

I don't get why most models of the i3 have asymmetrical tyres front and rear. They couldn't even choose standardtires so you can choose, but they chose limited tires, so you have little choice in what to get.

Re: Tesla Delivers Record 97,000 Vehicles in Q3

#182

Post by xkjkls »

npo9 wrote: post #106
rtempaccount1 wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not every loss making company is an Amazon in the making :) Tesla is likely coming to the end of the period where they have a relatively unique portfolio of products. We're starting to see the traditional car makers come up with competitive vehicles. Whilst Tesla may ride this out fine, it's likely to have an impact on things like margins, going forward.

Is there an electric car that is a true competitor to the Model S?

The Model S sales are down close to 70% YoY. That’s very obviously not the platform of the future

Re: Tesla Delivers Record 97,000 Vehicles in Q3

#183

Post by jm4 »

caconym_ wrote: post #141
threeseed wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And you seemed to have completely missed my point. Car companies have been doing nothing for years. But now for the first time they are all 100% committed to EV. And as we've seen with the Taycan, EQC and the ID.3/4 they can easily compete with Tesla.

> as we've seen with the Taycan and the ID.3/4 they can easily compete with Tesla. The Taycan is not really competing with anything but Tesla's highest-end and presumably lowest-volume products, and the ID.3 and 4 don't exist as production cars yet (AFAIK). Competing with them is obviously possible but these aren't very good examples.

The Taycan is DOA. If I want an electric car then I’m getting a Tesla because it’s the easiest to own, easiest to charge, the most proven and outperforms every other EV. If I want a Porsche then I’m getting a 911 turbo because it’s their most iconic car. I’m not about to spend 150k on their first attempt at an EV, the riskiest model in their catalog and the one that will most likely sell the lowest volume. I don’t understand where the market is for the Taycan. Forget about it being a “Tesla killer”. It’s good that they’re going electric. I hope they stick with it and do well. But Tesla has already established themselves as a premium brand. It’s not like Porsche is coming in and filling a void here. They are going up against the leader in the leader’s strongest segment, and one which is low volume and not much pie to share.

Re: Tesla Delivers Record 97,000 Vehicles in Q3

#184

Post by clouddrover »

jm4 wrote: post #183
caconym_ wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> as we've seen with the Taycan and the ID.3/4 they can easily compete with Tesla. The Taycan is not really competing with anything but Tesla's highest-end and presumably lowest-volume products, and the ID.3 and 4 don't exist as production cars yet (AFAIK). Competing with them is obviously possible but these aren't very good examples.

The Taycan is DOA. If I want an electric car then I’m getting a Tesla because it’s the easiest to own, easiest to charge, the most proven and outperforms every other EV. If I want a Porsche then I’m getting a 911 turbo because it’s their most iconic car. I’m not about to spend 150k on their first attempt at an EV, the riskiest model in their catalog and the one that will most likely sell the lowest volume. I don’t un…

> The Taycan is DOA.

No, they'll be selling about 20,000 a year which is what they always planned for. They're actually increasing production capacity at the moment:

https://electrek.co/2019/10/02/porsche-taycan-increase-produ...

> I’m not about to spend 150k

There are two cheaper variants on the way. Buy one of them if you want:

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/cheaper-porsche-taycan-ev...

Re: Tesla Delivers Record 97,000 Vehicles in Q3

#185

Post by [deleted] »

clouddrover wrote: post #180
jm4 wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A road trip where Porsche selected the route with one charge stop isn’t impressive. It’s not a long range car until the typical owner can drive the continental US - or at least most of it. I’ve never seen a fast charger anywhere besides a Tesla supercharger.

There are a number CCS charging networks in the US. Electrify America, EVgo, and ChargePoint have roaming agreements so the one account can be used across all networks: https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/evgo-electrify-america-ch... Tesla should convert their chargers to CCS now rather than sticking with a propriety plug. They've already converted their European chargers to CCS, although they're still not allowing no…

[deleted]

Re: Tesla Delivers Record 97,000 Vehicles in Q3

#186

Post by InTheArena »

alistproducer2 wrote: post #121

Good old zerohedge never misses an opportunity to shit on Tesla [0]. Question for Tesla owners: how is the reliability? I'd love to get unto an electric if only to never have to change my oil again but im curious as to what kind of maintenance requirements these cars have. [0] : https://www.zerohedge.com/technology/tesla-stock-tumbles-aft...

No problems with mine so far. No maintainence of any sort so far (12k miles) and the car is unquestionably better (faster, more features, better handling) then when I bought it a year ago.

That’s what the anti-Tesla crowd fails to understand.

Re: Tesla Delivers Record 97,000 Vehicles in Q3

#187

Post by llsf »

dragontamer wrote: post #175
llsf wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Chinese Gigafactory cost $5B and should eventually produce 500,000 cars (less than 10,000 a week like its counterpart in US). If it takes 5 years to wear out, then Tesla would have to make ~$2k per car produced to pay the factory. I am curious to see how this Chinese factory would perform in the next 6 months. Clearly the plan has been to produce more per factory, and it did not happen yet. But I have faith in au…

> But I have faith in automation to eventually improve the factory's output. Tesla's CapEx has been disappointingly low. Any kind of improved automation will require new equipment. Unless Tesla can scrape together more cash to improve their CapEx figures, its basically impossible for them to get "Better equipment". IMO, Musk is spending too much money on unnecessary projects (ex: Cuphead ported to Tesla. Full-self dr…

Yes, I agree Tesla might have spent money on non essential (more video games), or at least non-trivial return (self driving custom designed chip). But Tesla did acquire Grohmann (automation), which is kind of boring stuff like better factory equipment. On a side note, I have been bullish on automation for a couple years, and it did not pan out, both Fanuc and KUKA had a rough past year... so no revolution on the automation/robot so far.

Re: Tesla Delivers Record 97,000 Vehicles in Q3

#188

Post by moneytide1 »

threeseed wrote: post #117
caconym_ wrote: post #69

I've practically stopped hearing about Tesla in the news, which must mean they're doing great. Great job, Tesla folks!

Actually they aren't doing so great. Everything has changed. Before last year it was basically just Tesla and a few token cars e.g. Leaf in the electric vehicle space. Now every car company is jumping in and any detractors e.g. BMW CEO are being swiftly moved on. And so Tesla is now competing against the most highly capitalised, profitable and experienced companies in the world. Porsche Taycan is based on every revie…

I translate "losing hundreds of millions each quarter" to "using hundreds of their millions to get entrenched for the approaching Market Share Wars".

Re: Tesla Delivers Record 97,000 Vehicles in Q3

#189

Post by clouddrover »

danhak wrote: post #153
threeseed wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the EU for example Ionity is a superior charging network to Tesla's. And Tesla gets their batteries from the same place that everyone else does i.e LG. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-08-23/tesla-sai...

There are currently 474 supercharger stations in Europe vs. 150 for Ionity: https://supercharge.info/charts The link you provided refers only to the LG supply deal exclusively for Model 3 / China. Tesla owns the largest battery production facility on the planet (Gigafactory 1 in Sparks NV) which supplies battery in partnership with Panasonic.

> There are currently 474 supercharger stations in Europe vs. 150 for Ionity

But the difference is Ionity is CCS and all EVs can charge at its chargers. CCS cars can use any CCS provider like Ionity, FastNed, Allego, etc. which is the correct approach. I can fuel my ICE car at any fuel station and I should be able to charge my EV at any charging station.

Re: Tesla Delivers Record 97,000 Vehicles in Q3

#190

Post by danhak »

clouddrover wrote: post #189
danhak wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are currently 474 supercharger stations in Europe vs. 150 for Ionity: https://supercharge.info/charts The link you provided refers only to the LG supply deal exclusively for Model 3 / China. Tesla owns the largest battery production facility on the planet (Gigafactory 1 in Sparks NV) which supplies battery in partnership with Panasonic.

> There are currently 474 supercharger stations in Europe vs. 150 for Ionity But the difference is Ionity is CCS and all EVs can charge at its chargers. CCS cars can use any CCS provider like Ionity, FastNed, Allego, etc. which is the correct approach. I can fuel my ICE car at any fuel station and I should be able to charge my EV at any charging station.

While accurate, your post only serves to underscore Tesla’s strategic advantage here.
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