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Google Bus blocked, window smashed in West Oakland

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Re: Google Bus blocked, window smashed in West Oakland

#321

Post by yetanotherphd »

k-mcgrady wrote: post #25
jrockway wrote: post #4

It would be much better to have 100 more cars on the road during rush hour, right?

By providing free transportation from SF Google employees are encouraged to live there. Why not live closer to work? It would probably result in a few more cars on the road but a lot of the employees would move closer to Google freeing up apartments for people who actually work at businesses in SF and HAVE to live there. NB: I have no stake in this, I like in Ireland.

I imagine that, like most highly educated people, the people making these decisions do not think that the impact of Google employees on rent is their concern.

This is because in a free market, housing is like any other good. Some people happen to be particularly affected when competition drives up the price of a given good. But it is not for individuals to try to mitigate this effect. The most efficient and fair outcome is for the government to redistribute money, and for the poor to spend their money however they feel is best.

This is not libertarianism, it is basic economic theory that is shared by moderates on the left and right.

So Google has no moral obligation, or indeed any good reason, to discourage their workers from living in SF.

Re: Google Bus blocked, window smashed in West Oakland

#322

Post by jessedhillon »

9999 wrote: post #317
jessedhillon wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think you're effectively rebutting my larger point, which is that these protesters represent themselves as being of one population, when they are in fact of another. Certainly, if I change my statement to "some port workers" were economically damaged by the protest, purportedly on their behalf, in which they did not participate or call for, the point remains. Regarding the "convenient mis-characterization" --…

If your larger point is that they are representing themselves as being of one population (poor minorities), I would offer this counterargument: Let's assume that they are all shiftless, white, dreadlocked, trustafarians. They are not representing themselves as being OF that population of poor minorities but rather are advocating FOR the population of underrepresented, poor minorities. How then are they different than…

How then are they different than wealthy benefactors donating to AIDS relief or anti-malarial programs in Africa?

They are using violence (and the threat of violence) and presenting an outrageous sense of righteous indignation.

Re: Google Bus blocked, window smashed in West Oakland

#323

Post by 9999 »

jessedhillon wrote: post #322
9999 wrote: post #317

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If your larger point is that they are representing themselves as being of one population (poor minorities), I would offer this counterargument: Let's assume that they are all shiftless, white, dreadlocked, trustafarians. They are not representing themselves as being OF that population of poor minorities but rather are advocating FOR the population of underrepresented, poor minorities. How then are they different than…

How then are they different than wealthy benefactors donating to AIDS relief or anti-malarial programs in Africa? They are using violence (and the threat of violence) and presenting an outrageous sense of righteous indignation.

It seems that one of them committed a violent act here. They're not all doing that.

Re: Google Bus blocked, window smashed in West Oakland

#324

Post by erichocean »

valleyer wrote: post #212
9999 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you worked on a personal project on a Google bus (on your own laptop, without using their wifi), would Google be able to claim ownership?

They can often claim ownership of personal work you do at your own home. So yes.

Which is why I don't work for Google.

Re: Google Bus blocked, window smashed in West Oakland

#325

Post by gress »

Crito wrote: post #316
gress wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None of this is about protesting modern technology.

No, just the people who create it... Totally unrelated.

Absolutely so. The fact that they create technology has nothing to do with the protest.

Re: Google Bus blocked, window smashed in West Oakland

#326

Post by bonemachine »

api wrote: post #315
bonemachine wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That describes a huge fraction of today's protestors and activists, A rather untenable assertion, based on my own lengthy and up-close observation of e.g. Occupy at its peak.

Occupy was a brief but larger mass movement that drew in a much larger cross-section of folks.

Which is exactly what "they" are afraid of.

Re: Google Bus blocked, window smashed in West Oakland

#327

Post by jessedhillon »

antiterra wrote: post #148
anigbrowl wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He's nopt expressing venom for people who/are those things, but for those who use such status to justify the sort of violent nihilism on display in this article. I know lots of Burning Man/weirdo artist types who work hard, care about their neighbors, and manage to express their political views without slinging bricks through windows or justifying intimidation by calling it 'direct action.'

If he wasn't implicitly being derogatory about those traits (and I think he was) he's certainly not describing them as positive. The other responses echo the attitude that the problem results from these sorts with 'useless degrees.'

a) "useless" should be "economically useless" -- I myself majored in Political Science and it taught me a lot of valuable things, but it would be hard to earn a living on them.

b) Nothing's inherently wrong with Burners or their culture. Those traits listed are singled out because they (to me) uniquely identify a group which floats by on privilege while simultaneously claiming to be deep in the struggle of poverty. Almost by definition, anyone who can skip work for a week in summer and spend $300 on a BM ticket (plus associated costs) is not impoverished. To the extent that they are poor, I submit to you that they elect it, and thus to claim that they are victims of the same forces which keep the working poor down is ludicrous.

I am actually fairly liberal on these issues. What I resent here is the employment of race and class language to dress up what this really is: one group of overprivileged slackers angry that they now are on the receiving end of a gentrification wave, when they rode in on exactly such a wave!

The complete denial of their own privileged status, the pretension that they are in solidarity with the actual poor and disadvantaged (who are largely peaceful and hard-working) -- that's what gets to me. Nothing specific against Burners or the humanities.

Re: Google Bus blocked, window smashed in West Oakland

#328

Post by baddox »

ffrryuu wrote: post #282
baddox wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm just mean security guards. I doubt they are allowed to carry guns.

I like it that my sarcasm was treated like a serious comment :) j/k, but seriously, you want good relations with the community. You can't win with security guards.

At some point you stop caring about relations with the part of the community that is physically blocking your buses.

Re: Google Bus blocked, window smashed in West Oakland

#329

Post by baddox »

Crito wrote: post #195
baddox wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> He is advocating more restrictions Not at all. What makes you think that? The only thing I'm advocating is that if your non-work life is important to you (like it is with most people), eliminating commute time is one obvious way to expand that part of your life.

They have that option currently. The employees who do not live close to their work made the decision that commute time was not their primary concern.

I agree. Clearly these people would rather have fewer hours each day at home in the city than extra hours at home nearer their work.

Re: Google Bus blocked, window smashed in West Oakland

#330

Post by plywoodtrees »

Crito wrote: post #303
manicbovine wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, I apparently have a lot of time on my hands right now. No, it's completely non-standard to place quotes around just one word from an original source. Also, context is everything.

> No, it's completely non-standard to place quotes around just one word from an original source. It is non-standard in your particular dialect of English. It is common and accepted in others. See the discussion on the use of quotes in this HN discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6446077

One might even say it's "traditional".
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