241–250 of 255 posts
Most states have private prisons. We read about that all the time, mainly on how profitable they are. But unlike private health care, there's no one even poking it with a stick in the start up world.
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> Prisons are just the tip of the iceberg. Some of this has to do with African-Americans who have been living in poverty for generations stretching all the way back to slavery -- a situation which doesn't exist in Iceland. It also has to do with the US economic policies which promote the flight of low-skill jobs overseas. Not everyone has the intellectual ability to be a doctor or a web developer (especially given ou…
> Some of this has to do with African-Americans You could've stopped there. Black people as a race generally ruin every society they inhabit. If you haven't put your hands over your ears at this point and yelled "la la la!" you know it's true.
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Good point, I wasn't thinking of the revenge aspect. I guess the system in this case feels like it's purpose is to exact revenge on behalf of society
I don't really buy revenge as a distinct thing from punishment. Revenge is just the lizard brain's conception of punishment as a general method for social behavior modification without the benefit of statistics or specific evidence. Which is the reason why it isn't a legitimate goal. Punishment in proportion to the offense and targeted using evidence to achieve the desired results can be socially beneficial. Revenge…
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Good point, I wasn't thinking of the revenge aspect. I guess the system in this case feels like it's purpose is to exact revenge on behalf of society
I don't really buy revenge as a distinct thing from punishment. Revenge is just the lizard brain's conception of punishment as a general method for social behavior modification without the benefit of statistics or specific evidence. Which is the reason why it isn't a legitimate goal. Punishment in proportion to the offense and targeted using evidence to achieve the desired results can be socially beneficial. Revenge…
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If you are going to level an accusation like 'the majority of Americans think prisoner-on-prisoner rape is a-ok', then the burden of proof is on you. I won't even say that nobody thinks that way, I just want proof that this is the prevailing mindset.
The topic of prison rape is a joke that people as a whole feel comfortable laughing about in public . It is undeniably normative.
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This is pretty US-centered point of view, I invite you to look upon it from distance.
Poverty is an overwhelming contributing factor to crime and thus prisons. So, while my views are mainly focused on the US justice system in what other countries does this not apply?
People often ask the hypothetical of what sorts of behavior we consider normal today that people in the far future will regard as barbaric or bizarre. Our prison system is probably near the top of that list, for a variety of reasons. Not least of which is the sheer size of the prison population these days due to the war on drugs. Even more significant is the widespread societal belief that prison experience should be…
I cant imagine a politician saying that he will fund prisons get any votes whatsoever. It would be suicide. And whatever fruits would come from such measure , he would never see, and the population as a whole is likely to ignore.
This is the kind of problem that comes from Democracy, unfortunately. Not prisons, but the inherent inhability to address a real, provable issue that falls flat on public opinion.
I also believe this is an economic policy issue as well. The problem is exacerbated by increasingly unequal living conditions. Its no secret that crime and socio-economic status is highly correlated.
The above statements really make the problem a lot larger, however i believe this wont be fixed until something changes in the above, because convicts are the most politically and economically weak part of society.
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If the prisons were focused on fixing the root problem in the criminals, as if they were some sort of refuge for edification, conditioning and correction then a large body of the homeless would commit a strategic crime in order to get there so they can at least get three meals and an opportunity to move up in the world from rock-bottom. Like slavery in the 18th century, prisons are a necessary evil to punish people w…
Let me take a different tack on this response. If what you say is true, then why is this not an explicit part of our criminal justice system? Why are there no laws and regulations which spell out the brutalities that prisoners should be exposed to? Why is the process not formalized, institutionalized, documented, and routine? Why has there been no public campaign to repeal or modify the 8th amendment to the US consti…
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> And while we don't have proven-better alternatives for many of the problems that arise Oh please. The US has a recidivism rate within 3 years of 67.5%. Norway has a recidivism rate of 20% within 2 years. There are proven-better alternatives, but your society has decided not to implement them.
You can't compare recidivism rates between a 300M nation of immigrants a 5M nation with an extremely homogenous culture. The US has social problems that are worse than Norway's worst nightmares. Prisons are just the tip of the iceberg.
We're all immigrants if you dig back far enough, but in reality if you were born and raised in a country, you are not an immigrant and within a couple of generations, there are likely to be no real residual effects.
There are exceptions to this rule which are related to inheritance and cabals of cultre but for the most part, immigration seems to be a net gain, it's a lack of social mobility that is causing problems.
Modern Europe immigration policy seem are a bit fucked up, but I imagine you can pretty well correlate education and welfare with crime stats, but beyond that, hardening your ordinary criminal doesn't seem to help anyone.
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You can't compare recidivism rates between a 300M nation of immigrants a 5M nation with an extremely homogenous culture. The US has social problems that are worse than Norway's worst nightmares. Prisons are just the tip of the iceberg.
"nation of immigrants" - You know that kinda getting old. We're all immigrants if you dig back far enough, but in reality if you were born and raised in a country, you are not an immigrant and within a couple of generations, there are likely to be no real residual effects. There are exceptions to this rule which are related to inheritance and cabals of cultre but for the most part, immigration seems to be a net gain,…