Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The PyCon Incident

pastebin.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

191–200 of 1001 posts

Re: The PyCon Incident

#191

Post by wpietri »

Joeboy wrote: post #142
katbyte wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

as "a women in tech" (god i hate even saying it like that lol) i totally agree. i think what she did was absurd. It wasn't even a lewd or offensive joke. Maybe its my social group but something like that would even cause any of us (more women in tech) to even bat an eye. If it was bothersome in anyway it was they were so loud she was paying more attention to them and they private conversations and not the speaker. Sh…

Indeed, I am really puzzled as to why these "jokes" are supposed to be offensive to women. They might be offensive to people raised in some cultures / subcultures, and they don't sound like they're great jokes in any culture, but nobody ever told me about the meeting where women decided knob jokes were offensive. In fact a female friend texted me one about an hour ago.

Imagine this situation:

You are walking down the street. It starts to rain, so you duck into the nearest business, a bar. You order a beer, and realize that you have stepped into a gay bar. The table behind you starts making jokes about how virgin anuses are the best. They are pretty big guys, leather daddies. You worry they're talking about you, about your anus. You worry.

That feeling of discomfort? The way your heart speeds up as you start wondering if you're safe? Women feel that a lot.

The jokes aren't what's offensive. It's when jokes sexualize a professional context in a way that makes women feel unsafe.

Re: The PyCon Incident

#192

Post by jwonsu »

numbsafari wrote: post #89
blhack wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know, I've been thinking... It's also pretty unprofessional to wear jeans to work, and beer after 4:00pm on Friday is just a lawsuit waiting to happen. Also the schedule that the developers keep is really unprofessional. If one of the accountants tried to show up at 11:00am, they'd be fired! I also saw some pictures of one of our devs at Burning Man last year. He was wearing some sort of black, canvas skirt, and…

So... what if the situation were just a tad different.. Let's say it was an Indian guy who is a tech evangelist for a successful startup and two guys behind him in a "private conversation in the middle of a crowded room" made jokes about how indian people speak or act. Those are jokes, and totally unprofessional in a work environment where you are representing your company that is sponsoring the event, right? But we…

That's a terrible analogy. But if we must stick with your analogy it's more akin to an indian guy making a private joke to another indian guy about how indian people speak or act, and a mexican person in the row in front taking offense and reporting them.

But even then that would be ignoring the fact that their joke was not targeted at any single person, or any group of people.

Re: The PyCon Incident

#193

Post by tghw »

wpietri wrote: post #101
crag wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

BS. I'm getting sick and tired of people not taking responsibility for their actions. Now I do agree with you somewhat. I doubt she saw this "joke" as an opportunity to screw someone over (at least I hope so. If she did, then all bets are off); but that doesn't excuse her wrong. Her actions caused this guy to be fired. She needs to own it. Apoligize, Offer amends and move on.

Note where you stop in the causal chain: with the woman. You could blame the millennia of sexism that set up the situation. You could blame the gender-imbalanced context: it's easy for humans to be insensitive to minority views. You could blame the guy's parents and teachers for not raising him right. You could blame the guy for saying something inappropriate. You could blame his friends for not reigning him in. You…

Probably because she is engaging in hypocritical behavior that lead to a significantly negative impact on another member of the community?

Re: The PyCon Incident

#194

Post by zabomber »

Ah grow the fuck up already. You idiots make the "wider world" look at us and laugh.

So what if some dude made a joke of a sexual nature behind you. Just because you in a room full of dudes doesn't mean it's all about you.

And if you made that joke with her in mind, you're a dumb fuckwit who needs to grow up.

Are we all in grade 5 here?

Re: The PyCon Incident

#195

Post by basqio »

djcapelis wrote: post #90
sergiotapia wrote: post #17

I already sent SendGrid's sales department an email that I will boycott their company and recommend others do so as well moving forward. Where I work we were considering between SendGrid or Mandrill and this incident practically made our choice for us. We cannot and _will not_ support a company that backs[1] a person like this. [1] - https://twitter.com/adriarichards/status/314452708549603328

Want to tell us which company you work for so we can all avoid doing business with firms who makes decisions about which technology to choose based on whether or not they like the recent tweets of a company's employees on their personal twitter accounts?

Why ridicule someone for making a personal choice to choose who he does business with? Adria is a part of the company's image and just like any other company they will be judged by her public actions.

Re: The PyCon Incident

#196

Post by necaris »

GuiA wrote: post #92
whalesalad wrote: post #40

Most Europeans must just be laughing and pointing fingers at the insane political correctness in America and more specifically, the hacker community these days. I knew something was fishy from the get-go on this story but waited to see what else would come out of it. Thanks for this post, it articulates my feelings on the situation perfectly. People are outta control these days. We're turning molehills into mountains…

It is quite insane. I almost gave a tongue-in-cheek lightning talk at Pycon (mostly about python stuff, but with some tongue-in-cheek political jokes), and decided against it at the last minute. I'm glad I did, otherwise I feel like there would be HN headlines about me getting kicked out of Pycon :)

Nothing wrong with tongue-in-cheek. So long as it's something you'd be comfortable saying in front of your boss -- it's a professional conference, after all. The Code of Conduct is pretty clear.

Re: The PyCon Incident

#197

Post by bshastry »

integraton wrote: post #50

Her own phallus joke, as mentioned in the pastie, which she made on Twitter, a much more public venue: https://twitter.com/adriarichards/status/312265091791847425 Incredibly hypocritical on her part.

By far the best critique of her actions---her own action.

Re: The PyCon Incident

#198

Post by jamesaguilar »

rmk2 wrote: post #81
whalesalad wrote: post #40

Most Europeans must just be laughing and pointing fingers at the insane political correctness in America and more specifically, the hacker community these days. I knew something was fishy from the get-go on this story but waited to see what else would come out of it. Thanks for this post, it articulates my feelings on the situation perfectly. People are outta control these days. We're turning molehills into mountains…

Fefe is by no means "most Europeans", though he is quite well known as a ("political nerd") blogger in Germany. His comment on the matter, however, is less that of pointing and laughing and more that of worry, especially considering that there were some mild(er/ish) issues along similar lines in the wake of the 29C3. As a quick and dirty(!) translation of this blog post: http://blog.fefe.de/?ts=afb76b8d "The 'sexual…

> Smaller cons might possibly not admit women anymore

LOL? Is he serious here? If so I have to say he is misguided about how cons weigh of priorities. No con could get sponsors while denying admittance to all females.

Re: The PyCon Incident

#199

Post by angersock »

wpietri wrote: post #155
SODaniel wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not being able to make sexually explicit jokes in private at a public conference is absolute ludicrous. No question that the offender here is the person posting this out of context and seemingly out of spite.

This was not in private. Their mouths were, what, two feet from the ears in front of them?

Do try and see past the simple physics of the situation--it's clear that they expected any leakage in their message passing to be ignored.

Re: The PyCon Incident

#200

Post by nailer »

Joeboy wrote: post #142
katbyte wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

as "a women in tech" (god i hate even saying it like that lol) i totally agree. i think what she did was absurd. It wasn't even a lewd or offensive joke. Maybe its my social group but something like that would even cause any of us (more women in tech) to even bat an eye. If it was bothersome in anyway it was they were so loud she was paying more attention to them and they private conversations and not the speaker. Sh…

Indeed, I am really puzzled as to why these "jokes" are supposed to be offensive to women. They might be offensive to people raised in some cultures / subcultures, and they don't sound like they're great jokes in any culture, but nobody ever told me about the meeting where women decided knob jokes were offensive. In fact a female friend texted me one about an hour ago.

As assessments of body parts the men's behavior and the Sendgrid developer evangelists's tweets are more offensive to men who are being objectified based on their dongles.

The lesser issue still exists, though, of creating a 'sexual environment' where mentions of sex may make people who believe others may wish to engage them in sexual relations may feel threatened.

Post reply on HN