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US citizen charged after GrapheneOS phone wipes during airport search

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Re: US citizen charged after GrapheneOS phone wipes during airport search

#541

Post by epolanski »

chii wrote: post #287
runjake wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm waiting to see whether he is convicted before I form a strong opinion around this. I'm leaning toward thinking this case will be dropped or at least severely reduced charges.

There's a chilling effect from even just the arrest.

If you're against an academia for further police militarization you're a terrorist apparently.

And people are still convinced that's the land of the free, when it's a distorted non-representative democracy on top of a police state.

US is closer to South American banana republics than Iceland or Japan.

Re: US citizen charged after GrapheneOS phone wipes during airport search

#542

Post by hn_submit »

There are laws against the destruction of evidence, but I'd argue that there's no evidence in this case since they don't have clear-cut knowledge what's on the phone. It's potential evidence at best and it's therefore not clear if the law applies.

If Customs already knew whether the suspect had incriminating files on his/her phone things might be different.

Re: US citizen charged after GrapheneOS phone wipes during airport search

#543

Post by epolanski »

whack wrote: post #529

> US citizen charged after GrapheneOS phone wipes during airport search > It's concerning – and sends the message that [GrapheneOS] is criminal by default What's with this sensationalism? The GrapheneOS phone didn't just wipe itself - the defendant actively took steps to wipe it. The defendant isn't being prosecuted "by default" for having a GrapheneOS phone. He is being prosecuted for what he actively chose to do wi…

Doesn't matter, increasingly law enforcement is treating nicher secure OSs as a sign of illegal activity.

Re: US citizen charged after GrapheneOS phone wipes during airport search

#544

Post by VBprogrammer »

frgturpwd wrote: post #501
mcv wrote: post #493

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Security concerns you need to think about when visiting the US are absolutely no less than those when visiting China these days. Treat it like a totalitarian dictatorship with more technological means.

Honestly, I personally would be less nervous visiting China.

This has become a running joke with a couple of the people in my office who have recently visited China (from the UK).

The next 2 years will be interesting for democracy as a whole.

Re: US citizen charged after GrapheneOS phone wipes during airport search

#545

Post by unrealhoang »

nkrisc wrote: post #96
reenorap wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have the duress PIN on sticker on your phone. Maybe put it backwards and don’t say anything to border patrol. Have them try it out and erase the phone and then you can legitimately say you didn’t do anything and they did it themselves.

But if the prosecutors can make a convincing argument that your intent was exactly that all along, then you may end up convicted anyway. Intent matters. It might be hard to prove, but it matters. It may not even be that hard; what other possible explanation is there for someone putting a PIN visible on their phone that wipes it while crossing a border?

claim your password to be some derivative of the duress PIN, for example: 1234 is password reminder for 2444 (one 2 three 4), the device is erased anyway.

Re: US citizen charged after GrapheneOS phone wipes during airport search

#546

Post by itake »

invalidusernam3 wrote: post #483
itake wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

can you share the link? This? https://www.eff.org/document/eff-border-search-pocket-guide ---- Seems the better strategy (for iOS) is come in with a plan to say yes to agents without pissing them off (like handing them an empty phone). better to local back up, encrypt, upload to your home server etc. Then login to a fresh iCloud account, selectively install apps, photos, and mail accounts. So it doesn't look like you…

This seems like an insane thing to have to do for visiting a supposed first world country. If phones had been around during USSR times I imagine you would have had to do the same. Personally I will rather just avoid any travel to the US, and I hope others do the same.

Just out of curiosity, like what country would you not have to worry about this in?

The US is quite transparent about these rules, and certainly other countries are not necessarily searching peoples phones as publicly

But anytime I transit a country USA or any thing I fully expect to have zero rights

Re: US citizen charged after GrapheneOS phone wipes during airport search

#547

Post by hn_submit »

lefra wrote: post #534
hn_submit wrote: post #511

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, but without a jury O.J. Simpson never would've walked out of court a free man. For example in Europe when someone dies somebody always has to go to jail, even if they were defending themselves or responding to a potential threat. A jury could show compassion or empathy. Judges are extremely stoic in that regard.

> in Europe when someone dies somebody always has to go to jail Please cite the european law that states this.

There's no specific law, but a judge will always jail you for manslaughter.

Re: US citizen charged after GrapheneOS phone wipes during airport search

#548

Post by weli »

victorbjorklund wrote: post #444
reenorap wrote: post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There’s no way to prove intent if you keep your mouth shut and don’t answer anything.

Yea, that’s not how it works in practice. If they catch you standing over a dead body holding the murder weapon. Then you can’t just say they can’t prove intent if you keep your mouth shut.

Yea but that's where "reasonable suspicion" comes in a court of law. If you are standing next to a dead body, with a bloody knife in your hand.

Re: US citizen charged after GrapheneOS phone wipes during airport search

#550

Post by adrianN »

itake wrote: post #546
invalidusernam3 wrote: post #483

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This seems like an insane thing to have to do for visiting a supposed first world country. If phones had been around during USSR times I imagine you would have had to do the same. Personally I will rather just avoid any travel to the US, and I hope others do the same.

Just out of curiosity, like what country would you not have to worry about this in? The US is quite transparent about these rules, and certainly other countries are not necessarily searching peoples phones as publicly But anytime I transit a country USA or any thing I fully expect to have zero rights

European citizens can travel in the EU without even noticing that they are crossing borders most of the time. I once got lost on my bike and accidentally ended up in France for example.
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