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European "age verification" "app" forcing everyone to use Android or iOS

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Re: European "age verification" "app" forcing everyone to use Android or iOS

#291

Post by djaro »

casey2 wrote: post #158
skrebbel wrote: post #30

I agree wholeheartedly with the argument raised in this github issue, but I think people are wrong to be skeptical about the concept of a government-issued age verification app. Thing is, the status quo is absolutely worse. My 13yo son likes making Roblox games. Suddenly, some months ago, Roblox made a change where you’re not allowed to share your games with friends unless you do “age verification”, apparently in som…

Then get your kid off Roblox. I promise you that Roblox exploits more children in a single day than all sex offenders put together do in a year. Why is pedophilia such a problem on Roblox? It's because they heavily advertise towards children and one of the fastest ways for children to make money is asking their parents, then next is prostitution. Roblox is uniquely bad because they heavily advertise both products and…

This doesnt work when all of his friends are playing Roblox and play each others games on there

Re: European "age verification" "app" forcing everyone to use Android or iOS

#292

Post by AnimalMuppet »

dzjkb wrote: post #290
knorker wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your comment sounds like a politician who has just heard a magic technical incantation that solves everything. I'm sorry, you can't just drop "quantum computer", or "zero knowledge proof", or "flux capacitor", and think that you have solved the problem. Just dropping "zero-knowledge proof" as if it's a mic drop moment is like when Turnbull said "the laws of mathematics are very commendable, but the only law that appl…

literally 0 substance in a 5 paragraph comment, I'm starting to think this might be a not-exactly-human poster

First: That was six paragraphs, not five.

Second: There was some substance. Maybe not six paragraphs worth, but there was some. Here it is: You, when you said "zero-knowledge proofs", did not give much substance. How, specifically, is that going to work?

It's a bit rich for you to be complaining that knorker didn't have any substance, when the problem is that you didn't give any.

Re: European "age verification" "app" forcing everyone to use Android or iOS

#293

Post by stymaar »

duxup wrote: post #263

The unintended consequence of poorly thought out regulations (good or bad) can be wild. I’m still having to deal with making some sort of legal agreement with EVERY website I visit over cookies constantly… I just don’t care anymore / click whatever.

> I’m still having to deal with making some sort of legal agreement with EVERY website I visit over cookies constantly… I just don’t care anymore / click whatever.

That's the problem when you want to be pro-business while keeping the vague intent of protecting privacy.

They didn't mandate cookie banner, you can either not track or add a cookie banner. Of course businesses living off surveillance capitalism will chose the cookie banner. They could have banned tracking altogether, and chose not to because “it's bad for business”.

Re: European "age verification" "app" forcing everyone to use Android or iOS

#294

Post by gambiting »

afandian wrote: post #168
toasty228 wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The question is why they're pushing it onto everyone. I did not consent to this, neither did you. The representatives elected by Europeans did though: 483 votes in favor, 92 against

I doubt those representatives gathered a sufficient mandate from their public given the huge consequence. I’m no conspiracy theorist, but it does seem that there’s an international influence outweighing democracy. Cui bono?

I think that's trying to see something that isn't there, just to try and make some sense out of things. The reality is much simpler - they are elected parlimentarians, same as any regional government, and they vote without much thought based on quick brief summary. System to protect the children? Sounds great, let's vote yes - anyone who doesn't is a pedo, right?

Re: European "age verification" "app" forcing everyone to use Android or iOS

#295

Post by nkrisc »

SoftTalker wrote: post #138
skrebbel wrote: post #30

I agree wholeheartedly with the argument raised in this github issue, but I think people are wrong to be skeptical about the concept of a government-issued age verification app. Thing is, the status quo is absolutely worse. My 13yo son likes making Roblox games. Suddenly, some months ago, Roblox made a change where you’re not allowed to share your games with friends unless you do “age verification”, apparently in som…

We have had the need to prove age for hundreds of years. To buy alcohol. To drive a car. To vote. We depend on government-issued documents to do this. Not sure why anyone would really expect this to change just because it's online now.

Proving your age is a relatively new phenomenon. My grandmother, born in Chicago in the 1920s didn't even know her exact age. That is not at all uncommon for her generation.

Re: European "age verification" "app" forcing everyone to use Android or iOS

#296

Post by izacus »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #279
omnimus wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is not entirely true. I don't have much details but I know people who started to work on two separate free software projects aiming to make supported mobile OS. These projects couldn't get funding before but they do now. Afaik it's still a battle with AI companies lobbying that soverign AI is much more important than mobile OS but there is some growing interest. Imho i don't even think some linux based alternati…

Which is all well and good, but who is going to use those projects if the law requires them to use Android or iOS for age verification?

"The law" requires no such thing and there's nothing preventing those new OSes form providing proper security signals.

But is DOES require work - and it's much easier to complain than to put in work.

Re: European "age verification" "app" forcing everyone to use Android or iOS

#297

Post by izacus »

tokai wrote: post #286
mghackerlady wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They could try and put money into funding Jolla/sailfish/whatever

That wont help anything. Then you are just force to use Android, iOS, or Sailfish. It need to be a platform agnostic thing, else you're just hitching the fulcrum of civil society on private company.

Private companies providing public services is really not a rare thing.

Re: European "age verification" "app" forcing everyone to use Android or iOS

#298

Post by izacus »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #281
reloadtak wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Each member state has to implement the system themselves. Where is the loss of control?

The US federal government has been doing that to the states for a while now. They don't have the constitutional authority to do something, so instead they shove a lever under something they nominally are allowed to do and tell the states "do the thing we're not allowed to, the way we tell you to, or else." Where the "or else" is something like, they collect billions of tax dollars from your constituents that you then…

This isn't how EU works though (EU can actually directly order states arouns :P), so I'm not sure how that's relevant here?

Re: European "age verification" "app" forcing everyone to use Android or iOS

#299

Post by izacus »

athrowaway3z wrote: post #151
saltwatercowboy wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very obviously because privacy advocates are concerned by the effects of mass deanonymization. I find it doubtful that you don't grasp that.

I bought a bag of chips without having to show my ID. There is a big difference between: Government demands every website to have age verification, and government supported scheme by which service can opt into age verification. As of now, American private spyware is actively filling the demand. I get the feeling some privacy advocates are approaching the choice as a tier system, with government being the worst case.…

> I get the feeling some privacy advocates are approaching the choice as a tier system, with government being the worst case.

The issue is that a lot of voices you hear are from a big country which voted for fascists and those people now somehow think that technology will save them from the government they created. But that's not how it works unfortunately.

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