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US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

reuters.com

611–620 of 633 posts

Re: US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

#611

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why experience + cost effective model is IMO the best combination. Experience allows you to design the skeleton where the implementation details are often inconsequential. There are relatively few scenarios where an LLM would need more guidance to render an outcome, but even dumb local models can do that. Building a simple UI component vs an efficient multi-threaded bidirectional socket implementation (both ex…

> Experience allows you to design the skeleton where the implementation details are often inconsequential. Expanding on this thought a little more: it is possible to set up scaffolding that make incorrect implementations inconsequential. If the LLM can detect when the implementation is wrong, it can retry with the errors feeding back into the loop. This is shored up by up-front investments in tests, API definitions,…

This is a great point. In the past this is how I learned to architect software in general as you are never the only contributor and often must accommodate the contributions of contributors who are early in the careers. Good software architecture reduces the damage possible by low quality contributions.

I have had great success with contract driven development workflows in this regard.

LLMs being effectively very knowledgeable jr engineers, slot right into those patterns.

Another interesting thing is that Rust _really_ shines with LLMs. The compiler gives very helpful messages which the LLM bounces off very effectively. If it compiles, it works, you just need to double check the logic is correct.

By contrast, with something like Go, you'd need to be on the lookout for nil pointers, race conditions and so on. Node.js / TypeScript is less dangerous, but you still have memory leaks that aren't possible in Rust and lack pattern matching so must be vigilant about type discohesion.

Re: US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

#612

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In terms of price-to-productivity, nothing will beat DeepSeek right now. For what you have described, all of the existing frontier models will perform well (probably about the same even). If you expanded the list to very hard research tasks, Fable was so far ahead of the others that it doesn't even deserve debate. If you are a researcher doing something involving scientific computation or mathematics that wasn't reje…

I'm an engine programmer in video games on a big project - recently I'm mostly just fixing bugs. And Fable has been absolutely phenomenal in those 2 days we had it lol. It was genuinely the first time I didn't really have to reproduce a bug to fix it - Fable was able to really understand the code and interconnections between the systems to reason why it might have happened and fix it. Opus really struggles with that…

Something I wonder about in this domain is if this is the fault of the language.

Game development is usually in C++ or C#. With C++, bugs are a nightmare to find. C# less so, but there are still memory leaks possible.

I've been writing Rust for a few years now and it has been absolutely phenomenal. I get the performance of C++ and the only thing I think about when developing is the logic itself.

There aren't any mature game engines that use Rust (Bevy is rapidly improving, but it's no Unreal/Unity) - though you can compile Rust to a dll so it can be consumed by Unreal/Unity.

Due to the language constraints of Rust, I have found that LLMs need to work _way_ less to figure out bugs and render out code. The compiler gives very specific error messages and if it compiles, it works.

Re: US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

#613
post #602

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The klingon empire isn't a democracy, we don't delude ourselves that simply swapping one single person would have made a difference.

The same fact is true in a democracy. A democracy specifically is set up so just a single person doesn't rule. That's called a dictatorship. But you turn a democracy into a dictatorship through tribalism. So forgive me if I get mad at you trying to place me into a nice well defined box. You're helping erode the democracy I (and so many others) desperately want to maintain (and improve). What would Worf do? I'm certai…

Sorry that you're being blamed. People have a pretty negative sentiment towards Americans in general right now because we have been watching helplessly in horror as our best friend tears things down.

I have friends in blue states who didn't vote because it wouldn't have changed the outcome given the electoral college - it's unfair to blame them for not participating as they were never able to in the first place.

Not that democrats are angels. You guys are damned if you're blue / (extra) damned if you're red - given the state of both options.

I appreciate that you're doing what you can

Re: US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

#614
post #467

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The same Kim Dotcom who was arrested in Germany, extradited from Thailand to Germany, and most recently has been parroting Russian propaganda points about Ukraine? The same one whom the New Zealand legal system has allowed to exhaust every legal avenue and remains free to this day? There are much better examples to use to showcase the US's extrajudicial/international reach than this guy.

Laws are ultimately defined by the boundary and edge cases. The godly person, doing no wrong, that through unfortunate circumstances, is brought before the court does not advance our understanding of a law. It's the messiest case, by unscrupulous persons, in unconscionable circumstances that ultimately decide if the execution of that law gives the public more or less rights than on initial interpretation.

Yes, but public minds are not made up by edge cases. Surely a better example could be used rather than a divisive criminal.

Also, not sure how anyone except bad actors or sloppy readers could have gotten that I was defending the US here instead of criticizing using Kim Dotcom as an example in characterizing the US's actions.

Re: US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

#615
post #467

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The same Kim Dotcom who was arrested in Germany, extradited from Thailand to Germany, and most recently has been parroting Russian propaganda points about Ukraine? The same one whom the New Zealand legal system has allowed to exhaust every legal avenue and remains free to this day? There are much better examples to use to showcase the US's extrajudicial/international reach than this guy.

>and most recently has been parroting Russian propaganda points about Ukraine Yeah but is that a jailable offense though? What about his freedom of speech? Or should we just lock up everyone who says things we don't like?

Did I say it was a jailable offense? You might want to actually read what people write instead of arguing with your imagination.

Re: US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

#616
post #539

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not jailable. But I'm absolutely free to disregard moral agency of mr. Kim Dotcom and stop paying attention to whatever he says or what happens to him as a result of his support for warring Russia.

Would you be OK if everyone else disregarded the laws to see you punished for things not illegal?

No one said for the laws to be disregarded!? Why are you lying about what people are saying? Does it feel good to win against your own imagination?

Re: US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

#617

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The same fact is true in a democracy. A democracy specifically is set up so just a single person doesn't rule. That's called a dictatorship. But you turn a democracy into a dictatorship through tribalism. So forgive me if I get mad at you trying to place me into a nice well defined box. You're helping erode the democracy I (and so many others) desperately want to maintain (and improve). What would Worf do? I'm certai…

Sorry that you're being blamed. People have a pretty negative sentiment towards Americans in general right now because we have been watching helplessly in horror as our best friend tears things down. I have friends in blue states who didn't vote because it wouldn't have changed the outcome given the electoral college - it's unfair to blame them for not participating as they were never able to in the first place. Not…

Consider that USA's government logic is: "if we don't like a government we will kill civilians until they rebel and put a government we like". See Cuba for example.

So, by their own metric, they aren't helpless at all and should appreciate other countries aren't as savage as they are with civilians, instead of complaining.

Re: US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

#618
post #309

So this is the other side of banning American models for non-Americans? And how exactly do they plan on enforcing all of this? Great Firewall of America? This is a complete joke. The malicious clowns behind this should be removed from power and prevented from ever holding any position of power in any form of governance system.

They're probably going to ban GPU exports to China. Which will of course accelerate the development of their own GPUs. More products for us.

China already produced their first graphic card that got Microsoft WHQL certification.

Is it competitive enough? Probably no. Is there a software ecosystem for Chinese hardware yet? Probably no. But you know it will come soon.

Re: US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

#619
post #559
post #416

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The US is slowly becoming more like China. Hah, if only. Then at least it would see some of the benefits too. Instead, it's making sure to only copy all of the downsides, with zero of the upsides.

Bro, you have "grass is greener on the other side" syndrome. China is a totalitarian state not comparable to the US. Take this from a non-US citizen. There maybe some backsliding or ppl may think things are worsening in the US, but US citizens always have the power to make things right, coz they are free and they can bear arms.

I never said that "as of June 2026, the grass is greener in China". What I did say is that the US has rapidly been adopting all of the downsides of China with zero of the upsides. That's an observation.

> There maybe some backsliding or ppl may think things are worsening in the US

If you're phrasing this as "maybe" and "may think", you're not here to have a serious discussion.

Re: US holds off blacklisting DeepSeek, more than 100 firms deemed security risks

#620

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> US companies already stole scores of data to train their models on and it's hard to imagine they suddenly grew some integrity. Can you be specific about what data of yours were stolen by who?

Any text, code, image, video or audio they/anybody has ever uploaded to the public internet? Is this a real question?

How was it stolen, exactly?
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