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Microsoft's "fix" for Windows 11

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Re: Microsoft's "fix" for Windows 11

#201

Post by bluescrn »

lizknope wrote: post #169

I bought my first x86 PC in 1994 to install Linux on. I wanted a Sun workstation but couldn't afford it. I know people run an operating system to run programs on so it isn't easy to switch but so many windows users make it sound like they have Stockholm Syndrome. My advice as a Linux user of 32 years for normal people is to buy a Mac.

The Macbook Neo seems likely to be a a huge seller. It's got the price of entry down to where it's now the obvious recommendation for less-technical friends/family wanting an affordable-but-nice laptop for light home/office/student use.

I suspect it's going to hurt iPad sales though, as a real Mac running MacOS is vastly more capable than any iPad.

Re: Microsoft's "fix" for Windows 11

#202

Post by CrimsonRain »

BLKNSLVR wrote: post #101
Havoc wrote: post #48

Their office subscriptions are also going up in price at. Crazy rates. Giving Stiff competition to food price inflation All because it has some AI stuff on it that I don’t want.

Funny thing: I wanted to try out Copilot to help with creating a starting point for a diagram in Visio. Copilot isn't in Visio (at least in the subscription my work pays for). I used Copilot's chat interface instead, and it is unable to generate a diagram in the Visio .vsdx format; it tried, failed, tried to fix it, failed. Sigh.

I opened a blank document and pasted a fairly large markdown text. Converting it to word (or html) formatting is easy, there are online tools and/or any other LLM can do it. This one time I opened the Copilot willingly and was excited about getting it done with a few keystrokes: "convert to word formatting".

It generates a formatted response but cant edit the document. How stupid you have to be to integrate copilot and not allow it to update text in a text editor??!

Re: Microsoft's "fix" for Windows 11

#203

Post by Silhouette »

In the end this kind of thing always comes down to trust and choices. Microsoft has by its choices and actions lost the trust of many of its customers. Some of those customers did not have a viable alternative available and so had to accept whatever Microsoft was offering even if they didn't really like it. For those who have had viable alternatives some will have chosen them and presumably will continue to do so. With the shift towards using online services at work and the decreasing reliance on desktop applications more of Microsoft's customers are probably finding they do have viable alternatives.

Speaking only for my own small business in the UK we have never understood how it can be possible to comply with our legal and regulatory constraints on issues like privacy/confidentiality while using an operating system that is under the control of another company with a proven track record of forcing updates that are incompatible with those standards. Issues like pushing saving/uploading to OneDrive or the potential implications of Recall if they do push it out are very serious concerns if you're working with any kind of sensitive data.

For us the "last ever version" of Windows was Windows 7. We aren't confident that we could legally use Windows 10+ for a lot of our real work. We are too small to run the enterprise editions where they don't dare try to remove control from corporate IT departments in the way they have been forcing on everyone else. So apart from occasional testing for products where the users are likely to be running on Windows we exclusively use other platforms now. I don't see that ever changing back unless there is a root and branch reform of Microsoft starting with totally new senior leadership because it's no longer a technical decision or based on the capabilities of the products.

Re: Microsoft's "fix" for Windows 11

#206

Post by afandian »

arowthway wrote: post #66
afandian wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with stndef. "Flowers after beating" is a very direct evocation of physical abuse in an intimate relationship. Whether or not you think it's appropriate.

If you don't claim it's inapropriate then what's left to agree about?

There are all kinds of language registers for communication. From formal business speak to 'locker room banter'. What is appropriate or otherwise depends entirely on the participants of the conversation. So, it depends on what kind of conversation we're trying to have.

I think this post's usage is meant deliberately to be a bit edgy, to illustrate how badly Microsoft has behaved.

An encouragement to be mindful of language, and therefore discuss what shared context we're trying to build, shouldn't be so controversial in a self-professed 'thoughtful' [0] forum.

Personally, data point of 1, I think it's a bit distasteful, and would prefer to participate in a community that doesn't routinely use that kind of langauge.

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Microsoft's "fix" for Windows 11

#207

Post by bonoboTP »

randoadmin wrote: post #142
alexb_ wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most people want a computer that works with their software. No, "learn the FOSS version" is not a solution. Especially because nearly everyone has some niche thing they like, some 5% that isn't covered by the FOSS solutions, that only a niche Windows program can actually do correctly. And that doesn't even get into gaming.

Well, considering that you can run almost anything (excluding games and specialized graphics software) with 99.99999% guaranteed result via WinApps, I don't see what the issue is for a hypothetical member of the majority population. It's not 2016 anymore, you don't have to switch to LibreOffice if you need an office suite of apps. That obviously would be preferable, but if you're an avid Microsoft ecosystem user, jus…

What percentage of MS Office user can, in your estimation, complete the steps as described in this readme?

https://github.com/winapps-org/winapps

Re: Microsoft's "fix" for Windows 11

#208

Post by HexPhantom »

ccppurcell wrote: post #152

I believe they are abusing their customers but I think it's in poor taste to compare this to domestic violence.

The underlying point about power imbalance and gradual normalization of bad behavior is fair, but that analogy carries a lot of real-world weight that doesn't map cleanly to software decisions

Re: Microsoft's "fix" for Windows 11

#209

Post by alexb_ »

fainpul wrote: post #170
alexb_ wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most people want a computer that works with their software. No, "learn the FOSS version" is not a solution. Especially because nearly everyone has some niche thing they like, some 5% that isn't covered by the FOSS solutions, that only a niche Windows program can actually do correctly. And that doesn't even get into gaming.

Then at least let the company that makes your niche software know that you want a Linux version of it, even if you don't use Linux (yet). We need to solve this chicken / egg problem. Nobody wants to use Windows, they want to use some specific application. If most software is available on Linux too, then consumers can actually choose their OS.

Company? Most of the time this stuff is years (sometimes DECADES) old. That's why it doesn't work on Linux in the first place.

Re: Microsoft's "fix" for Windows 11

#210

Post by HexPhantom »

ptero wrote: post #11

Microsoft lost its way much earlier than 4 years ago. It abused users at the time of Netscape wars and forcing Internet Explorer down people's throats. But they hit an infinite gold mine with government adoption and for the last 30 years no amount of bad engineering was able to shake off government use. Windows 11 is bad? Yes, but did you try Microsoft Teams? The only way to force Microsoft into "users matter" engine…

Even if gov adoption dropped, I suspect the incentives wouldn't change much unless there were genuinely viable, low-friction alternatives.
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