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End of Japanese community

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Re: End of Japanese community

#321
post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand people like this. No, I don't want to "hop on a call", I've already written down everything. Can you not read?

It's a combination of inability to read anything longer than a tweet and not wanting to put anything on record.

"We tried but this unpaid volunteer didn't cooperate by continuing to work for free"

Re: End of Japanese community

#322
post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand people like this. No, I don't want to "hop on a call", I've already written down everything. Can you not read?

It's a combination of inability to read anything longer than a tweet and not wanting to put anything on record.

I'd say otherwise - it's a reach out to have a relationship. It's hard to have human relationships only by writing. Of course the best way to build it is to meet in person, but if impossible - it's always good to have a video call.

If someone is frustrated, the following chats won't do much really. They have already built a wall, and we need to meet around it, not throw our letters over it.

Re: End of Japanese community

#323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know why you're being downvoted, you're exactly right. The person replying is probably not an expert in this. But they want to get more details so they can figure out how to get it to the right people with more information. This is how it's supposed to work.

* * *

I wonder if you and the person who replied really understands how you feel when you have been part of something over 20 years and see it destroyed by tone deaf changes to text. I have no idea how Sumobot works, but it is easy to see how Mozilla or an organization with top down "ship-it-fast" incentives can trample a community led project. This is really not a question of AI, the same thing happens with professional translators.

I have had to cooperate with coporate

Re: End of Japanese community

#324
Mozilla is more and more disappointing. Always talking about making an internet for everyone, community, bla bla. But then they don't even talk to their own community contributors before changing their workflow. And when someone speaks up, they get the most corporate reply possible.

Re: End of Japanese community

#325
post #317
post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is it condescending and patronzing? I read it as a person trying to understand the situation.

I'm not part of Mozilla or any of the communities and I understood the situation by reading the damn post, on the first time. In the follow-up, any words concerning how the person feels, words on how to talk about this further, and wanting to truly understand what he just wrote in plain and simple terms simply reek strongly of "we really won't change anything, we've made our decision, we are disagree with you but we…

yup.

it's american english for "oh this must be hard for you. how can we help you to cope?" and no intent to change.

a better response would rather be:

"We're sorry, we were not aware. please can we meet and you help us understand? so we can fix this situation? We'd also like to share our intentions and we hope together we can improve the situation."

telling

Re: End of Japanese community

#326
post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand people like this. No, I don't want to "hop on a call", I've already written down everything. Can you not read?

It's a combination of inability to read anything longer than a tweet and not wanting to put anything on record.

> not wanting to put anything on record

It is clearly this. Management hates written communication.

Re: End of Japanese community

#327
post #13
post #7

10+ years in Japan. The message here is much deeper from my perspective. “Let’s jump on the call” is not the solution. The guy was stripped off of his face. I love Japan for being human. Small business bar or restaurant with 3 tables. Not everything should be streamlined for a quick call solution… the process was pushed on his head. Google nemawashi decision making process

I did as you suggested with respect to “nemawashi.” I read about that and “ringi,” and I’m glad I did. Even to get just the gist of what I’m sure is a thin interpretation: that nemawashi refers to a “laying-the-groundwork” process of circulating a proposal between peer-level counterparts, before formalizing it and proposing to act on it. Much less crashing in with it in the form of a “SumoBot,” as Mozilla seems to ha…

I predict that these times of excessive trust in AI during decision making will be written in history books at some point of time. Providing that there will be books at all.

I already suspect that Duolingo destroyed real people's recording of Spanish conversations and replaced them with AI. For example I can quite often hear continental Spanish accent which has never been taught to me before (as I started with Duolingo as a freshman) - it used to be always American Spanish accent. Wrongly cut conversions is another matter.

Re: End of Japanese community

#328
post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a combination of inability to read anything longer than a tweet and not wanting to put anything on record.

I'd say otherwise - it's a reach out to have a relationship. It's hard to have human relationships only by writing. Of course the best way to build it is to meet in person, but if impossible - it's always good to have a video call. If someone is frustrated, the following chats won't do much really. They have already built a wall, and we need to meet around it, not throw our letters over it.

Your claim is based on the very strong assumption that if you have a phone or video call with a person that you already hate, things will get better.

My life experience does tell me that this is often not the case: if people are already frustrated and have built a wall, it is better to use something more impersonal, like such an online text discussion.

Re: End of Japanese community

#329
post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, how the perfect reaction would be if you were at charge? I understand people have sympathy inclination to victims, so everyone would assume the victim is good and other side is bad. I have worked long enough with japanese people knowing they can throw unpredictable tantrums. As a manager, what would be your best course of action to deal with similar situation?

Acknowledging the mistake immediately seems like a good start, as I've said. Life doesn't always have to be from the perspective from “a manager”, these are community volunteers doing untold hours of unpaid work. Just be a person, whose acquaintance is upset you replaced their handmade postcard with an AI-generated one.

Acknowledging a mistake, no matter genuinely or not, doesn't solve the situation. It just makes victim feel good a bit.

Agree on manager view, I was rather putting situation in a wrong perspective. It doesn't change the questions though - what would you do to resolve the situation (not to make the other side feel good)?

Re: End of Japanese community

#330
post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a combination of inability to read anything longer than a tweet and not wanting to put anything on record.

I'd say otherwise - it's a reach out to have a relationship. It's hard to have human relationships only by writing. Of course the best way to build it is to meet in person, but if impossible - it's always good to have a video call. If someone is frustrated, the following chats won't do much really. They have already built a wall, and we need to meet around it, not throw our letters over it.

Who wants "a relationship" here with some manager who has just delivered the standard corporate nonpology? The problems are listed in the first message, start by fixing them.
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