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Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

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Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#191

Post by tbrownaw »

CraigJPerry wrote: post #181
tbrownaw wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Effectiveness of regenerative braking depends on having an extremely large battery that can sink enough current to stop the car. An EV can do that, hybrids at best help the brakes out some. You just can't charge the battery fast enough doing anything but a very slow rolling stop. This seems a bit exaggerated. Staying regenerative-only does require sticking to about half or so of how fast I could stop, but so far th…

100% of possible system capacity to accept regenerative charge on a smaller battery system will be a smaller absolute number than 100% of possible on a larger battery. If you assume everything else is constant, motor, inverter, battery C-rating etc.

The manual says it's energy recovered (ie, not something relative to system capacity), and this seems consistent with the other indicator that shows instantaneous braking power with a distinction between what the regenerative system is doing vs what (if anything) the traditional brakes are doing.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#192

Post by [deleted] »

Helmut10001 wrote: post #124
dyselon wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We finally gave up our Prius after 12 years, and we never changed the brakes once. The brakes were just peeking into the yellow on its last service upgrade. I was really impressed with how well the "normal" hybrid could take advantage of regenerative breaking, honestly.

I first changed the brakes on my Mitsubishi Space Star (combustion) after 13 years. It is a small car, less than 1000kg, so there is little for the brakes to do. If we produced more percentage of small cars, many environmental risks would be reduced. And btw.: The tires are now 19 years old and still good (less weight, less abrasion!).

[deleted]

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#193

Post by djrj477dhsnv »

tbrownaw wrote: post #185
djrj477dhsnv wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a whole lot of assumptions based on what? I could come up with a list of plausible sounding reasons why regenerative braking leads to less tire wear. Unless you have some actual measurements, I wouldn't trust either one.

I'm reading it as referring to a setting where the car will brake some amount (instead of coasting) if you completely let go of the pedals, and as being a claim that the commenter can't maintain speed but gets stuck in a cycle of accelerating and then letting the car brake.

I've never driven an EV, only a hybrid a few times, but I thought for all cars with aggressive regenerative brake settings, you just kept the accelerator pedal slightly depressed to coast.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#194

Post by lazide »

Helmut10001 wrote: post #124
dyselon wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We finally gave up our Prius after 12 years, and we never changed the brakes once. The brakes were just peeking into the yellow on its last service upgrade. I was really impressed with how well the "normal" hybrid could take advantage of regenerative breaking, honestly.

I first changed the brakes on my Mitsubishi Space Star (combustion) after 13 years. It is a small car, less than 1000kg, so there is little for the brakes to do. If we produced more percentage of small cars, many environmental risks would be reduced. And btw.: The tires are now 19 years old and still good (less weight, less abrasion!).

Beware of dry rot. Rubber that old is likely not in as good shape as it might appear, and could fail catastrophically in the right conditions.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#195

Post by masklinn »

cloverich wrote: post #153
frollogaston wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And manual transmission cars kinda, though the energy is still wasted of course

Surprisingly you can get nearly same effect in automatics. I put around 60k miles on my first automatic (after120k+ on my first two cars, manual transmissions) and when i got my brakes checked at 63k they noted my brakes were still "brand new". I do gamify reading traffic to try and brake as little as possible (to help pass time etc), but was still surprised how far this takes you given i do plenty of stop and go tra…

No reason for it not to work, even more so if you think to downshift. It’s more common with manual as downshifting is a lot more natural but not fundamentally different.

It’s just trivially easy with electric thanks to regen braking.

Though with modern cars getting heavier if you have a small ICE these days you have almost no engine brake which makes some cases more difficult (unless it’s a mild hybrid with an electric kers like some of the small engined fords). SUVs tend to have giant engines and pretty high rolling resistance, which I’d think would somewhat compensated for their higher inertia.

It’s all about learning your car’s behaviour and planning for it.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#196

Post by talldan »

brtkwr wrote: post #49
ghushn3 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are you doing to your tires that they only last 10k miles? I think that might be a driver error issue, because my EV (a heavier sedan) basically never needed tire replacement barring me running over a screw or something.

Just normal driving, it wasn’t quite so bad on our previous car which was a Nissan Leaf (with 30kWh battery) but our current Kia Niro just has a lot bigger batter (64kWh) and it is a lot heavier I suppose, the tyres just don’t seem to last as long. I’m pretty sure I’m using summer tyres all year round (I live in the UK) this was recommended by the dealer

Some EVs have low rolling resistance tires to increase the range. I think they will wear out faster, especially if cornering sharply.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#197

Post by ljf »

sockaddr wrote: post #109
brtkwr wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just normal driving, it wasn’t quite so bad on our previous car which was a Nissan Leaf (with 30kWh battery) but our current Kia Niro just has a lot bigger batter (64kWh) and it is a lot heavier I suppose, the tyres just don’t seem to last as long. I’m pretty sure I’m using summer tyres all year round (I live in the UK) this was recommended by the dealer

I'm sorry but I've got two EVs and I'm not seeing anything like what you're reporting. On my first set of tires for a model S I got 60k miles which is longer than I usually like to run tires but they were still in good shape. My driving pattern is about 80% grandpa-mode and 20% speeding to loud music. I assure you. If your EV tires are only lasting 10K miles you have one of the following cases: - You are driving VERY…

He (like me) is in the UK - unless you go for a brand name, many of the tyres people run here are low quality import tyres - while 10k is low, my ICE has occasionally only got 20k from a set, but that is mainly due to the tyres cracking from sun damage (still got over 4 year out of them before that happened).

Cheap tyres are often a bad investment, but I drive country lanes with a higher risk of punctures and I was burning through brand name tyres, a full set is worth more than my car!

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#198

Post by gambiting »

nine_k wrote: post #41

I suppose the same should apply to hybrid cars, which outnumber pure EVs significantly [1]. The effect comes from converting the kinetic energy back to the battery charge via generation instead of wasting it via friction, which is the whole point of hybrids. [1]: https://www.consumeraffairs.com/automotive/how-many-electric...

It does. My Volvo XC60 T8 PHEV is a 400bhp 2.2 tonne SUV and after over 5 years of ownership the pads are about 20% worn. And I don't drive like a granny either. The car just does most of its braking with the EV motor.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#199

Post by apichat »

> The EIT Urban Mobility report also refers to the bigger picture: moving commuters out of private cars and into public transport, cycling, or walking can achieve up to five times more reduction in non-exhaust emissions than individual electrification.

And this is just one the many nuisances produce by cars.

Electric cars do not massively reduce almost any of the pollution produced by cars.

We have to reduce the automobile fleet by at least 95% to solve all the nuisances produces by cars.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#200

Post by HPsquared »

aetherspawn wrote: post #28

I pick up a bad screw every year from careless Ute drivers with leaky toolboxes and have to throw 1-2 tyres in the bin. Tyre wear isn't that important to me.

A lot of tyre shops offer insurance which might be beneficial for you if you reckon you have a higher-than-average rate of punctures.
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