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Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

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Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#261

Post by Aeolun »

spondylosaurus wrote: post #6
WarOnPrivacy wrote: post #4

Synopsis and excerpt: [Rest] markets itself as a way to "unlock a new revenue stream" with the help of a "robust algorithm" for detecting smoking. Hotels where these sensors are installed rack up complaints and negative reviews, after Rest sensors register false positives - thereby unlocking that revenue stream for the hotels. The awesome thing about black-box algorithms is they can't be challenged when they're wrong…

I scoured their website to look for any clues about how it might (allegedly) work and got a fat lot of nothing. > Rest constantly monitors room air quality, using a proprietary algorithm to pinpoint any tobacco, marijuana, or nicotine presence. So a smoke detector with an "algorithm" attached. Uh huh. How does that algorithm work? > By analyzing various factors and patterns[...] Some cutting edge shit here! And as fo…

This is like those 10k bomb detectors that were just a box with wires dangling out aren’t they?

I do not understand what possesses people to buy this stuff without proof.

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#262

Post by dilyevsky »

nordsieck wrote: post #244
lxgr wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hopefully hotels don't yet have an industry-wide "do not host" list without any appeal process...?

> Hopefully hotels don't yet have an industry-wide "do not host" list without any appeal process...? There are lots of small operators, so I doubt that there's some industry wide list. But there are only a few large operators. I'd be shocked if some of them didn't share info.

Hyatt and Marriott share their info with everybody every few years when they get hacked

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#263

Post by satellite2 »

ludicrousdispla wrote: post #116
jfengel wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there that much smoking in hotels? Do they charge more for smoking rooms? A number like 84x suggests that it's basically zero now. That kinda makes sense. The only one who would notice is the cleaning staff, and relying on their word for "it smelled like smoke" sounds like a way to get a chargeback. They'd call you on it only if they were forced to take the room out of rotation to air it out. So maybe there are a…

The last time I walked into a hotel room that smelled like cigarette smoke was in 1998, so I would think this is very uncommon.

Using an ozone generator you can remove all odors in a medium sized room in less than 30min. Only poorly organized cleaning staff would have this issue.

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#264

Post by MiddleEndian »

SoftTalker wrote: post #189
MiddleEndian wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The smoke detector in my previous condo used to go off all the time when I showered. Had to remove it shortly after moving in lol

Must have been placed improperly. They should not be installed in kitchens or in or near bathrooms. But also, you should run the exhaust fan in the bathroom when you shower, this removes at least some of the moist air and cuts down on the chance for moisture damage and mold to develop.

It was in the hall right outside the shower, the exhaust fan didn't work very well so I left the door open. I live in a different place now and no longer have that issue.

But the point is that machines are not particularly good at detecting smoke lol

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#265

Post by nine_zeros »

lxgr wrote: post #162
hansvm wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The big problem is the power imbalance. There's a reason they start your stay by putting a hold on a credit card. And even if you could charge them, they can afford a legal battle better than you.

Oh, that's a common misunderstanding, but they can't sue me in court – by accepting me as a customer, they accepted my binding arbitration agreement! It clearly said so on my luggage tag their authorized agent (i.e. the bellboy) handled as part of check-in.

>Oh, that's a common misunderstanding, but they can't sue me in court – by accepting me as a customer, they accepted my binding arbitration agreement! It clearly said so on my luggage tag their authorized agent (i.e. the bellboy) handled as part of check-in.

Why can't there be a human membership union that sets these automatic binding arbitration agreements on service providers on behalf of members? Is there any law preventing a class of people from creating such a customer's union?

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#266

Post by Marsymars »

grishka wrote: post #84
stogot wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I assume if it’s triggering on car exhaust or something from opening room windows

Hair dryers are mentioned several times, so I would assume one of the things these sensors look for is a rise in the air temperature.

Hair dryers set off particulate sensors when used to dry hair. The air purifier in my upstairs office goes crazy when my wife blowdries her hair in the bathroom across the hall.

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#267

Post by SoftTalker »

MiddleEndian wrote: post #264
SoftTalker wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Must have been placed improperly. They should not be installed in kitchens or in or near bathrooms. But also, you should run the exhaust fan in the bathroom when you shower, this removes at least some of the moist air and cuts down on the chance for moisture damage and mold to develop.

It was in the hall right outside the shower, the exhaust fan didn't work very well so I left the door open. I live in a different place now and no longer have that issue. But the point is that machines are not particularly good at detecting smoke lol

Smoke detectors detect microparticles in the air. They typically don't or can't differentiate between steam and smoke, at least not the cheap household type detectors.

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#268

Post by Marsymars »

jfengel wrote: post #155
ludicrousdispla wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The last time I walked into a hotel room that smelled like cigarette smoke was in 1998, so I would think this is very uncommon.

I can't recall the last time. Smoking in the US is way, way down. Not gone, to be sure, but it was crashing even before vapes.

In particular, it’s way, way down among the cohort of the population that have lifestyles amenable to staying in hotel rooms.

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#269

Post by sixothree »

criley2 wrote: post #211
yubiox wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only if you want to get banned from ever staying in a hotel again

Obviously charging back Hyatt won't get you banned from Hilton. And the response question would be: Why would you returned to a hotel chain that scammed you?

Because that's where you job books when you travel?

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#270

Post by raverbashing »

spondylosaurus wrote: post #6
WarOnPrivacy wrote: post #4

Synopsis and excerpt: [Rest] markets itself as a way to "unlock a new revenue stream" with the help of a "robust algorithm" for detecting smoking. Hotels where these sensors are installed rack up complaints and negative reviews, after Rest sensors register false positives - thereby unlocking that revenue stream for the hotels. The awesome thing about black-box algorithms is they can't be challenged when they're wrong…

I scoured their website to look for any clues about how it might (allegedly) work and got a fat lot of nothing. > Rest constantly monitors room air quality, using a proprietary algorithm to pinpoint any tobacco, marijuana, or nicotine presence. So a smoke detector with an "algorithm" attached. Uh huh. How does that algorithm work? > By analyzing various factors and patterns[...] Some cutting edge shit here! And as fo…

> A: Our sophisticated smoking detection algorithm has been tested for accuracy in real-world scenarios, backed by years of development, and tens of thousands of hours of rigorous testing and validation.

I would be willing to bet a good amount of money they have a huge pile of nothing on this

On the other comment they say they monitor PM2.5, CO2 and humidity. Congratulations, your hot water shower with hard water just triggered the sensor. $500 fee.

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