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China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

wsj.com

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Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#291

Post by riehwvfbk »

throwawayq3423 wrote: post #277
Spivak wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think a good chunk of America had their "Soviets seeing an American supermarket" moment on Red Note when they got to see what city life is actually like in China from the perspective of regular people.

Red Note is Instagram for rich kids. If China managed to frame their upper class as ordinary, good for them. Propaganda win for their regime. Not sure why we are making that mistake here.

Try actually traveling outside the US. It's eye opening. The rest of the world has been developing and the US has been backsliding. It's impossible not to notice.

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#292

Post by riehwvfbk »

throwawayq3423 wrote: post #278
mandmandam wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try YouTube. Just use your eyes.

I did. When I went to China and left the major cities all I saw was rows of high rises next to train stations with nothing around them. Funny, that's never on YouTube.

If you leave major cities in California you see a lot of empty space that's mostly brown-grey dust, with occasional small towns where everyone is very poor and came from Mexico. Your point?

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#293

Post by byw »

prairiedogg wrote: post #167
yieldcrv wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of developed countries like across Europe and Singapore dont have the same geopolitical history with China as the US does, as such the Sinophobia isn’t really there Many people really enjoyed Shanghai and other cities and are recipients of expansive social safety nets of China If you’re middle class and in a big city or some of the planned cities, China is fine, not without its difficulty of adjusting to, some…

China has never been a place, historically, that has welcomed foreigners as anything other than short-term visitors. To the extent that it has, those foreigners have become Chinese (Manchu, Mongol - and the "welcome" there is uh… being used pretty liberally). From a legal and policy perspective, there are very few paths to long-term residency in China for people who are not of Chinese descent, and of the nominal few…

My impression with the visa situation is that while technically green card is very difficult, in practice most expats have no issue renewing their work visas, so effectively living as long term residents - buying properties, getting married, and sending their kids to (mostly international) schools. I've also seen quite a few who worked for a few years and then started their own businesses.

In terms of how well expats integrate, I've seen people from across the spectrum. There are definitely those who are meshed into the local social circles. Foreigner privilege is a thing, and I find that how you view social status is a strong determinant in how well you integrate. Those with a more egalitarian mindset seem to do well in this regard.

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#294

Post by riehwvfbk »

whynotminot wrote: post #191
rcpt wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think we'll see born-in-the-USA Americans moving to Shenzhen anytime soon. But a huge fraction of our workforce is immigrants who have given up their homeland and distanced themselves from their families and communities in search of opportunities here. The fact that we're driving them away now does not bode well for our future economy.

A lot of immigrant communities actually voted for Donald Trump this time though. I don’t understand it. But it happened.

If someone said "Americans do X", there would be some pushback about "not all Americans". But somehow it's normal (expected even) to bunch all immigrants together into the "they were all desperate and decided to jump the fence" pile.

It's actually surprising that this point is so hard to understand.

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#295

Post by throwaway48476 »

fieldcny wrote: post #156
throwaway48476 wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know when the cold war ended the archives briefly opened up. It's not a moral case, merely a factual one.

As is the case that Trump, Musk, Vance and Thiel are Russian assets. It’s just common sense to use Trumps own words. Just remember that as these people drag us into a war for “peace”

The term for them is useful idiots not assets. The democrats did enormous damage to the Ukrainian cause pushing the russia hoax in 2017/18. Steele assumed there was competent intelligence analysts to analyse what he collected but instead it was politicians.

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#296

Post by suraci »

YZF wrote: post #283
suraci wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Even if the conduct of the US authorities here is/was suspect the retaliatory arrests is how the Mafia operates when i said "Many Americans are complicit through their silence, denials, and defense." i didn't expect such a combo...

I am not an American. So that's one off your combo. I was also not silent or defensive of the specific action of arresting her. I thought that was a mistake by Canada and said so at the time. I still think so. I'm not denying anything? I still stand by what I said though about the rogue actor here being China. That is a big picture statement. It means that even if the actions of the US or Canada were wrong, they were…

thanks for correcting

Not only Americans are complicit through their silence, denials, and defens

for example, i've referenced a very famous poem by a Chinese liberal:

> If I am doomed to die in war in this life, then let me be a ghost under the precision-guided bombs of the United States. - Written on the 15th day of the Iraq War.

back to the topic

> It means that even if the actions of the US or Canada were wrong, they were within what we consider the rule of law.

first, discovered foreign spys are assets just prepared for situations like this, if 'my' spys were arrested by 'your' authority, 'I' will arrest yours and make a deal to exchange, except in this situation Meng is not a spy but a important business women

second, if it's wrong, but it's within the rule of law, doesn't it mean the rule of law is 'wrong'?

and, what do you think about hunter biden and trump donald, are they guilty? is it 'the rule of law' that they are free of judgment? or did the rule of law judged they are not guilty?

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#297

Post by diebeforei485 »

blindriver wrote: post #68

I worked at a well-known company that told us we couldn't bring any work electronic devices to China, because there was a risk malware could be installed on it. They advised us not to bring any personal electronic devices either, like phones because they could be confiscated at the border and returned with malware installed on it. It makes sense that this happens. I'm curious why they haven't attempted to tighten the…

It's not in their interest to do so. Tesla is the EV leader and exports many vehicle from China to other countries. Additionally, Elon has a direct line to Trump, it makes no sense to burn bridges.

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#298

Post by maxglute »

Philpax wrote: post #284
ForTheKidz wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are models with open training as well as weights. It's not chatgpt, but that trained model can be fully audited and reused without further training. I think for most daily use I'd be fine using a greatly outdated model. Open source has always relied on contributors eating costs—even just the opportunity cost of contributing time. FLOSS software is slow, much slower than VC-funded explosive growth, but it's hard…

It'll get increasingly difficult for open models to keep up with proprietary frontier models as the costs involved increase. Yes, there will always be older open models available, but at some point, they just won't be as competitively useful. Your code assistant that can output a file's worth of code will pale in comparison to systems that can create entire projects in seconds. If it costs billions to reproduce the l…

>who's going to do it and give it away for free

Why not Deepseek? Sometimes rich tech bros have billion dollar hobbies instead of billion dollar yachts or billion dollar foundations. Just takes a few not monetarily motivated but has more money then sense visionaries types willing to turn their very, very expensive hobbies into charities. Now if we enter the 100s of billions / trillions territory...

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#299

Post by maxglute »

ra7 wrote: post #118
kasey_junk wrote: post #27

The interesting thing in this article isn’t that China is telling people to avoid the US for national security reasons. Many states, including the US have similar guidance to people who work in jobs sensitive to national security. What’s interesting is that China is viewing AI tech as a technology vital to their security.

Is it any different than the US? The US considers AI national security too, which is why they banned chip exports to China.

And US workers from working in PRC semi... something PRC will probably eventually do for strategic tech.

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#300

Post by alexlur »

YZF wrote: post #273
ande-mnoc wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The intent of the original "boast" is to somehow claim the know-how comes solely out of China. No, it isn’t. It’s likely they mean they haven’t studied aboard or have worked in the U.S., which has been long seen as a prerequisite to innovate in the tech industry there. My original comment was merely citing what they think. It’s unfortunate that you cannot tell the difference between describing and endorsing.

Here's the sequence: >> Why does the US still allow Chinese nationals to study at its universities and work at its companies? Seems like a big risk that cutting edge research and trade secrets will go to America’s main adversary. Industrial espionage by China has a long history, and China has more valuable things to steal from America than the other way. > I have good news for you. DeepSeek openly bragged that none o…

I don’t have a position. I’m simply very curious how this will play out.

You don’t have to guess what they mean since the CEO did an interview about it: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42845612

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