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H-1B visa fraud alive and well amid anti-abuse efforts

theregister.com

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Re: H-1B visa fraud alive and well amid anti-abuse efforts

#191

Post by karakot »

vishalontheline wrote: post #138
karakot wrote: post #117

I only have one proposal. If a company has a layoff in number of thousands, then the company should be barred from h1-b for a certain number of years.

This is an interesting proposal. Unfortunately, the way around this is a "business solutions" company, whose main solution is providing H1-B'd temps to large companies. There are tons of those around: local companies hire people on H1-B. Foreign companies send people over on L1.

Yeah, thank you for reminding that the most of simple solutions are wrong usually.

Re: H-1B visa fraud alive and well amid anti-abuse efforts

#192

Post by sys_64738 »

tivert wrote: post #157
sys_64738 wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

H1-B visas are non-immigrant visas so anybody coming in on one knows it's finite then they need to leave after the fact (assuming they don't change status).

> H1-B visas are non-immigrant visas so anybody coming in on one knows it's finite then they need to leave after the fact (assuming they don't change status). So what? I don't see how that's relevant to the question, unless you're being unreasonably legalistic. Also, I've known only one person in my career who came to the US on temporary visa who intended to leave. Everyone else's ultimate goal was a green card.

I know plenty who have left after a few years. Maybe you don't know many people on non-immigrant visas.

Re: H-1B visa fraud alive and well amid anti-abuse efforts

#193

Post by kachurovskiy »

rel2thr wrote: post #151
kachurovskiy wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.bamf.de/EN/Themen/Statistik/BlaueKarteEU/blaueka... I haven't heard of any discontent with the program from locals or applicants. It's growing, too.

the locals aren't upset about salaries? German programmer salaries seem to be on par w/ unskilled labor. If I was a local I would want to stop immigration until supply + demand equilibriated around USA levels.

EU citizens always had an option to come and work so work visas only apply for non-EU. Also, the debate in Germany is mostly about asylum seekers and not skilled migration. I haven't heard the thesis "less people, more pay" but instead "more workers, more taxes". https://www.reddit.com/r/AskAGerman/comments/178iy0w/questio...

Re: H-1B visa fraud alive and well amid anti-abuse efforts

#194

Post by psychlops »

jandrese wrote: post #175
psychlops wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indentured servitude is without pay by definition.

No, that's slavery. Indentured Servitude is slightly more complex where the person is paid (poorly), but is beholden to the employer in one way or another that makes it impossible or at least impractical to seek better conditions. In the past it was debt slavery, as in you get paid but that money goes towards working off some debt that the company imposed, often unfairly. But it can also include things like holding o…

No, slavery is slavery. Indentured servitude is a services contract.

Re: H-1B visa fraud alive and well amid anti-abuse efforts

#195

Post by Nifty3929 »

CPLX wrote: post #174
Nifty3929 wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is not the case. Indentured servitude is labor that was paid for in advance by some service provided - e.g. passage to another country. Just because payment was received in the past, or that it was in-kind, doesn't mean the labor isn't paid labor.

You can’t quit and walk away from indentured servitude.

Perhaps not, but that doesn't mean it's not paid for. And in any case, I'm sure the terms would have been different in different cases, and it probably was possible to quit if you were able to pay for your previously-rendered services in some other fashion.

Of course, these are just details. Fundamentally, those indentured were held captive and forced to work. But that still doesn't make it unpaid, or involuntary for that matter. The bondage existed only to enforce the terms previously agreed to. I have no way to know, but I imagine many indentured servants were happy with the trade, though many also weren't. Lots of fraud too, with people being tricked into it.

As I write, I can't help but think of student loans which have similar characteristics.

Re: H-1B visa fraud alive and well amid anti-abuse efforts

#196

Post by psychlops »

Nifty3929 wrote: post #165
psychlops wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indentured servitude is without pay by definition.

That is not the case. Indentured servitude is labor that was paid for in advance by some service provided - e.g. passage to another country. Just because payment was received in the past, or that it was in-kind, doesn't mean the labor isn't paid labor.

I mean...sure...if you want to call the exchange of one service for another "pay". Even though the rest of the world uses that term for money. But what is your point, do you think it is equal to the OP's assertion?

Re: H-1B visa fraud alive and well amid anti-abuse efforts

#197

Post by rmccoy6435 »

bedobi wrote: post #137
rmccoy6435 wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Those countries are only afloat because of immigration. According to who? You? One of the countries you specifically just listed has just tamped down on some immigration efforts [1]. [1] https://www.beehive.govt.nz/release/government-responds-unsu...

A right wing populist clamps down on migration, color me surprised, it must be because of real problems and not to appease anti migrant voters. It's very interesting how NET migration figures are rarely mentioned when this happens. Yes migrants are entering NZ in record numbers but citizens and migrants alike are also leaving in record numbers. (not uncommonly for the exact reasons I mentioned - the NZ economy is not…

I am about the most opposite of a right wing populist as you could be. I was simply calling out your grandstanding and hypocrisy; I don't care what side of the aisle anyone is on, I will call out people being that snide in discourse any day of the week.

Still waiting for your citation about how to measure a populations "ambitions" and how that factors into economics. Maybe work on the source citing, and a bit less on the personal attacks.

Re: H-1B visa fraud alive and well amid anti-abuse efforts

#198

Post by tivert »

CPLX wrote: post #170
tivert wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So basically you want to extend the luck/financial privilege that those people have had to be able to study in the US to extend to additional advantages for future visa applications. Not sure that I’d clasify that as fair, personally. It's not fair to uproot someone from a life they've already established , just to give someone else a chance. Also, this is a US policy meant to serve US goals. Absolute fairness to s…

The problem with your plan is that it essentially grants the ability to determine which people get to immigrate to the admissions committee of private colleges. If you propose that you have to defend it on policy grounds. I don’t like that idea at all, that decision is the function of a democratically elected government.

> The problem with your plan is that it essentially grants the ability to determine which people get to immigrate to the admissions committee of private colleges.

Who said anything about "admissions committee of private colleges"? 99% of the immigrant college grads I've known went to public colleges, most of which were not particularly selective.

And even if "admissions committee of private colleges" were given that exclusive power, that sounds a lot better to me than the mindless operation of an unjust lottery.

IMHO, all OPT visa holders should be given first dibs on H1-Bs, in front of the likes of HCL and Google bringing new people in.

Re: H-1B visa fraud alive and well amid anti-abuse efforts

#199

Post by briffle »

cherryteastain wrote: post #9

Why is there a lottery anyway instead of a salary ranking/salary threshold system? This'd disincentivize bad actors, ensure the US domestic labor pool is not undercut, and (more or less) lead to higher quality H-1B immigrants.

If the problem is a lack of local talent in the US, then it seems like a reverse auction would be the best way to ensure they aren't just importing cheap indentured servants. And the money brought in from that reverse auction could be used to fund education where there is the most demand.

Re: H-1B visa fraud alive and well amid anti-abuse efforts

#200

Post by eropple »

FrustratedMonky wrote: post #115
eropple wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Don't you think that the 3 year college student bucket, and the generally other buckets, would suppress jobs/salary of the local US population? Only if you can find somebody to hire--because it's important to realize that H-1B applies to more than just computer touchers. Before we got married, my wife was on an OPT. Her employer was not used to hiring foreign nationals, but they literally couldn't find somebody who…

It is easy to forget that H1-B applies to lot more than tech workers. Is there any statistics on the break down between the jobs types? I'd think with all the outcry over 'taking jobs'. That maybe the law should be adapted to have different quotas and rules for different industries.

> I'd think with all the outcry over 'taking jobs'. That maybe the law should be adapted to have different quotas and rules for different industries.

Probably should, but you would have to have the votes. In an environment where approximately half of the House and the Senate needs right-wing, nativist "heartland" votes to exist, it's unlikely to shift the calculus in favor of delivering benefits to American software developers: a demographic generally perceived as generally centrist to liberal (so why would they vote for Republicans if they helped improve this?), already well-off (so why do they need the help?), and chiefly coastal (so are they even in these votes' jurisdiction?).

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