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Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

macleans.ca

331–340 of 362 posts

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is a mistake to blame the high cost of housing on market forces. It is largely the product of local housing policy. It is a choice.

I think it’s both. Housing policy can help or hurt but overall many places in the world have stuggled to keep housing prices affordable.

Expensive housing is almost entirely an Anglo nation problem. If you don't restrict infill development you won't have this issue.

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#332
post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not exactly what you're getting at, but you might enjoy Christopher Alexander's essay "A City is not a Tree". It also talks about why highly planned cities can end up not working and feeling "right" in the way that older more incrementally-grown ones can.

Take Tokyo for example. It’s ugly and massive and sprawling but, connected with amazing transit, there is not only plenty of housing for everyone at all income levels, but the place is also just totally rad.

Tokyo is ugly because of its tropical summers; if you tried to build the Western idea of "not ugly" there would be mold and insects everywhere.

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#333

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the proponents of project are using an explicit racial justice narrative to counteract criticism of their violation of norms. Pretty easy to do when some of the criticism indeed sounds kinda racist. Example from the article: > In 2022, Gordon Price, a prominent Vancouver urban planner and a former city councillor, told Gitxsan reporter Angela Sterritt, “When you’re building 30, 40-storey high rises out of concrete,…

It seems like he's expressing criticism over the racial narrative that this is an "indigenous way of being" building project instead of another corporate development that happens to be built on indigenous land. Obviously, no one is expecting indigenous people to use ancient building techniques that haven't been used in centuries, but the groups behind the project are making the explicit claim that the project is some…

"Corporations" don't come from nowhere. Anyone can be a corporation, and building a building involves hiring professionals.

The idea that developers are all evil space aliens comes from your unconscious memory of 80s kids movies where they were the villains.

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#334
post #37
post #3

I think this is terrific. It's high time the indigenous people reclaimed their sovereignty. The idea that "When you’re building 30, 40-storey high rises out of concrete, there’s a big gap between that and an Indigenous way of building" is just ridiculous. Who the fuck are you, white man, to say what is and is not consistent with an "Indigenous way of building"? You aren't living the same lifestyle and building the sa…

> Who the fuck are you, white man, to say what is and is not consistent with an "Indigenous way of building"? A person univolved with the colonization of Canada, not even from there or living there, that still believes that? > You aren't living the same lifestyle and building the same buildings that your ancestors were hundreds of years ago And that's bad in a lot of ways too. Not all modernization is for the better.…

Gentrification has nothing to do with Starbucks. Gentrification is caused by blocking infill development.

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#335
post #248
post #120

It's comforting to see first nations of canada recovering a central role in modern canadian society. However, having lived here for a year a year now, I have observed a concerning aspect of this re-integration, which is mentioned in the article: First nations aren't just propped back up and re-integrated in society, it goes further in that they are given special rights that go beyond what any other class of canadian…

2024 Canada is an absurd time and place to be alive. Canada 2024: - Universities have "Black only" swim hours and segregated "Person of Colour" buildings - "no whites allowed". - Indigenous people get special treatment by courts (the courts were literally instructed not to hold them to the same standards as others) - The courts now use the term "person with a vagina" to refer to women - Land acknowledgements... Every…

What a strange view to call this an "absurd time and place to be alive" and that the "country is imploding". Lots here needs sources as it's hard to verify or taken out of context.

> Land acknowledgements... Everywhere

No they're not. They're heavily used within the government but in the private sector I have never experienced anyone doing a land acknowledgement.

> My wife works for a government organization, and even their internal emails have land acknowledgements in them. She has to take 1-2 days of DEI training per month.

Since I also have a partner working for a government organization and they don't have to do anything even remotely close to "1-2 days of DEI training per month" so this doesn't seem to be universally true.

> The courts now use the term "person with a vagina" to refer to women

Are you referring to the couple of times the supreme court has used that term? At least one of which dealt with sexual assault. You make it sound like courts universally use that term - that is false.

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a city completely inundated with skyscrapers, it's odd -- and maybe a bit telling -- that some people become concerned for the first time in their lives only once an indigenous nation decides to build a skyscraper.

I get concerned when anyone builds a skyscraper. It's typically purported to increase density and thereby create affordable housing. What actually happens is that I still can't afford anything in the skyscrapers, even in non major metros, and I'm in the top 1% of earners. I guess affordable only applies to the top half of a percent? Destroying land to build them, I don't care who's land, is typically in opposition to…

Notice that asking questions is downvoted. Horrifying. Must be someone very rich that wants another skyscraper apartment that the rest of us can't afford, no matter how many lives they ruin.

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#337

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Part of the point of reconciliation is to accept unequivocally the sovereignty of indigenous peoples. Is it not morally questionable to ignore indigenous peoples' sovereign rights (over fishing, forests, lands, etc.) as we have been doing up until now?

How can this work in practice, though? Wouldn't acknowledging indigenous peoples' sovereign rights over their lands require the formation of entirely new nations with their own borders and laws and military and courts etc etc that would cover the entirety of canada ? If they are have the right of a sovereign over these lands then can't they just tell everyone else to leave?

Canada is already a federal structure with overlapping jurisdictions. Adding another layer to it complicates things, but doesn't fundamentally break anything. Treaties are just more laws in a constitution that is already a mix of Common Law, written law, (French) Civil Law, our history with the BNA act, and our recent constitutional patriation.

The USA has similar treaties, and the US Supreme Court has been flip-flopping trying to decide the limits of Oklahoma criminal authority in half the sate. It can be messy.

See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McGirt_v._Oklahoma and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oklahoma_v._Castro-Huerta

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#338
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's irrelevant to "does this follow indigenous tradition or violate it" point, which is the point discussed in the subthread - not tribal lands/indigenous rights.

Why would Indigenous people have to follow tradition? I believe it is racist (or sexist) to say that a group of people cannot do something because that is not something they've done in the past. For Mr Gordon Price to imply that a group should not do something because it has not been done before is him trying to deny their agency.

No one said they do. The article provides no background or context from which one could conclude an implication that "a group should not do something because it has not been done before." He didn't say that. The article attempts very poorly to imply that meaning. You've created a dummy to punch and you're punching it. Unfortunately this is all too common. It's called a straw man fallacy.

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#339

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it’s both. Housing policy can help or hurt but overall many places in the world have stuggled to keep housing prices affordable.

Expensive housing is almost entirely an Anglo nation problem. If you don't restrict infill development you won't have this issue.

Housing is extremely expensive in China as well. It’s one of the main barriers to Chinese yuppies having the three kids their government wants them to.

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only reason Israel was founded were it was, can only be justfied by its first nations like connection to the chosen territory. It was not like Britain was lacking other colonies, protectorates, and mandates to choose from for the Jewish people at the given time.

Indeed several other locations such as Uganda were considered and were leading candidates beforehand. It originated as a colonial project, not a "land-back" initiative. > Herzl approached Britain because, he said, it was "the first to recognize the need for colonial expansion." According to him, "the idea of Zionism, which is a colonial idea, should be easily and quickly understood in England.38 In 1902 Herzl approac…

I've wondered a few times if Uganda had been chosen instead, if Idi Amin ever would have rose to power...
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