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The average Greek is working a full 40% longer than the average German

bbc.co.uk

81–90 of 152 posts

Re: The average Greek is working a full 40% longer than the average German

#81
post #71

Very interesting to see that Norway is the 2nd most productive, but ranks 3rd in fewest hours worked! Makes me feel good about leaving work at four. ;)

But what is that number anyway? It's probably just GNP / people. ? Norway will look good in that respect due to the oil.

Re: The average Greek is working a full 40% longer than the average German

#83
post #4

Well BBC ran a show last night. And it did show the some reasons why Greece is such trouble today. It turns out people spent like crazy, far beyond their means. Things like electricians driving Porsche's and High End Mercedes cars. All of it imported from Germany. When a nation full of people with government included involves in such spending it is but other wise natural that they price for it later on. The anchor di…

When a market is flooded with easy, cheap money distortions occur. Witness the housing excesses in the U.S. prior to 2008. This is a phenomenon of human nature. Excess credit inevitably leads to too many bad loans.

This stuff is cyclical. The deregulation of S&L rates in the 1980s led to huge problems.

Re: The average Greek is working a full 40% longer than the average German

#84
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes that's the documentary, Its a nice one to watch. What I realized about the entire chapter of Greece was that you can't blame the government and corporations for all the problems in the world. Sometimes we as individuals need to step back and think of our own financial future. Reckless spending on our behalf without planning for the future are disastrous. Savings and investments are important for our future. And w…

Two points: 1. I wouldn't think for a second that Michael Portillo is a reasonable unbiased analyst here. 2. How do we prevent individuals from spending recklessly? Seems like government is going to have to play a large part in that story. On (2), it's not an issue of blame, and personally I'm not interested so much in who to 'blame' - we're doing economics, not philosophical ethics. Rather it's an issue about what w…

2 is a good question. One answer is presumably mandatory payments for social security and health insurance. You can't spend money recklessly anymore that you gave to the taxman.

Re: The average Greek is working a full 40% longer than the average German

#85
post #72
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Germany has massive part on it by enforcing such shockingly low borrowing rates across the Eurozone. It completely destroyed countries with immature Real Estate landscapes, countries used to high inflation rates that collectively shot themselves in the foot. Germany and France took no hostages when they were stagnating and failed to meet EU requirements. They gave absolutely no regard to these countries and now they…

Germany 'enforced' the borowing rates? Let's look a few years back. The rating agencies rated all kinds of junk very high. The banks all over the place where very creative with products hiding the risks. When Germany was asking for tighter regulations we were ignored or laughed at. Now the Germans simply demand that the lessons are learned and we see structural reforms - reforms which can not be done by just throwing…

Yep, they pretty much control the rates.

This is not "a few years back" - this clusterfuck has been brewing since year 2000 with the euribor. At that point several countries needed high rates to stop their overheating borrowing and they were given a shower of petrol to stop their fires.

Re: The average Greek is working a full 40% longer than the average German

#87

I don't know about Greece, but I grew up in Portugal, and I suspect there are some similarities. People in Portugal "work" long hours. But they also work in a very infective way: long useless meetings, everything requires lengthy social interactions, bizantine bureaucracy, too many managers for too few real workers and so on. There are complex cultural problems that cannot be expressed by such simplistic metrics (and…

Input vs output

Re: The average Greek is working a full 40% longer than the average German

#88

I don't know about Greece, but I grew up in Portugal, and I suspect there are some similarities. People in Portugal "work" long hours. But they also work in a very infective way: long useless meetings, everything requires lengthy social interactions, bizantine bureaucracy, too many managers for too few real workers and so on. There are complex cultural problems that cannot be expressed by such simplistic metrics (and…

I'm not sure that's specific to Portugal - in Brazil most of the companies are like that as well.

But that's only going to change when "we" build companies with that culture, no?

Re: The average Greek is working a full 40% longer than the average German

#89
As the 4 columns show, productivity & hours worked go diametrically opposite (negatively correlated). All the countries in the most working list are also in the least productive list. So, it still doesn't change the German assertion that Greeks are not doing enough.

Second, the article itself accepts - " because the two labour markets are structured differently, it is actually hard to compare like with like."

That means the headline is pointless as it is contradicted by the sentence above.

Re: The average Greek is working a full 40% longer than the average German

#90
post #6
post #4

Well BBC ran a show last night. And it did show the some reasons why Greece is such trouble today. It turns out people spent like crazy, far beyond their means. Things like electricians driving Porsche's and High End Mercedes cars. All of it imported from Germany. When a nation full of people with government included involves in such spending it is but other wise natural that they price for it later on. The anchor di…

"Its almost like a third world country" If it looks like a third world country, then where did all the money go? Presumably the majority of people aren't driving around in Porsches?

The phrase "third world" has nothing to do with economic conditions, and everything to do with allegiance to a particular policito-economic block. Thanks to the work of the allies (and particularly the brits) during the closing parts of WW2 Greece is aligned with NATO after WW2. After the collapse of the soviet union I don't know that it makes much sense to talk about 1st, 2nd and 3rd world countries any more.
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