Why is there no mention of taxes here? Isn't the single biggest factor that the Greek tax system is corrupt from the ground up?
The average Greek is working a full 40% longer than the average German
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Re: The average Greek is working a full 40% longer than the average German
#12Unfortunately, as long as Greek companies don't pay taxes, Greeks can work as hard as they can the situation will continue to deteriorate.
Not sure why you were downvoted, widespread tax evasion in Greece is certainly a contributing factor for the trouble they're in. You can build an apartment building, have an 'uncompleted' top floor, and therefore pay no tax on the building.
http://www.vanityfair.com/business/features/2010/10/greeks-b...
Re: The average Greek is working a full 40% longer than the average German
#13[deleted]
Re: The average Greek is working a full 40% longer than the average German
#14It does not matter how long you work. What matters is what you get done in a week.
This. The far more important column is the second one about Productivity. And Germany leads the way there with no mention for Greece.
Working more hours to produce the same thing is bad, not good.
Re: The average Greek is working a full 40% longer than the average German
#15Well BBC ran a show last night. And it did show the some reasons why Greece is such trouble today. It turns out people spent like crazy, far beyond their means. Things like electricians driving Porsche's and High End Mercedes cars. All of it imported from Germany. When a nation full of people with government included involves in such spending it is but other wise natural that they price for it later on. The anchor di…
Are you referring to this documentary? Michael Portillo's Great Euro Crisis From http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01hllyd Self-confessed Eurosceptic Michael Portillo visits debt-stricken Greece. He believes that the euro crisis must have shaken the Greeks' faith in Europe's single currency and wonders if there'll be a desire to revert to the free-floating drachma. In Athens he meets everyone from a destitute young fa…
Yes that's the documentary, Its a nice one to watch.
What I realized about the entire chapter of Greece was that you can't blame the government and corporations for all the problems in the world.
Sometimes we as individuals need to step back and think of our own financial future. Reckless spending on our behalf without planning for the future are disastrous. Savings and investments are important for our future. And we need to think of it.
There is a point where the government's job ends and ours begins.
Re: The average Greek is working a full 40% longer than the average German
#16Well BBC ran a show last night. And it did show the some reasons why Greece is such trouble today. It turns out people spent like crazy, far beyond their means. Things like electricians driving Porsche's and High End Mercedes cars. All of it imported from Germany. When a nation full of people with government included involves in such spending it is but other wise natural that they price for it later on. The anchor di…
"Its almost like a third world country" If it looks like a third world country, then where did all the money go? Presumably the majority of people aren't driving around in Porsches?
> where did all the money go
They spent the money.
It's no difference to running up a big credit card debt, but at some point you have to pay it back.
What went wrong for Greece was it maxed out it's government credit card and none of the banks would let them up their credit limit.
Now the goverment doesn't have a lot of money comming in but it still has a massive debt.
That debt has to be payed back or else they have to default (i.e. go bankrupt).
Re: The average Greek is working a full 40% longer than the average German
#17Well BBC ran a show last night. And it did show the some reasons why Greece is such trouble today. It turns out people spent like crazy, far beyond their means. Things like electricians driving Porsche's and High End Mercedes cars. All of it imported from Germany. When a nation full of people with government included involves in such spending it is but other wise natural that they price for it later on. The anchor di…
I don't think that's why these stats are interesting. There seems to be a stereotype of lazy Greeks being bailed out by hard-working Germans. These OECD stats (which I originally checked out after an episode of Radio Open Source featuring economist Mark Blyth) show that this is just another example of an ugly, incorrect stereotype.
Although I agree that its wrong to say All Greeks are lazy, Its also true that they didn't manage their money well.
Now I'm not too much of an economist. But I would be annoyed if my money is used to bail out somebody for mistakes they made.
Re: The average Greek is working a full 40% longer than the average German
#18Well BBC ran a show last night. And it did show the some reasons why Greece is such trouble today. It turns out people spent like crazy, far beyond their means. Things like electricians driving Porsche's and High End Mercedes cars. All of it imported from Germany. When a nation full of people with government included involves in such spending it is but other wise natural that they price for it later on. The anchor di…
I don't think that's why these stats are interesting. There seems to be a stereotype of lazy Greeks being bailed out by hard-working Germans. These OECD stats (which I originally checked out after an episode of Radio Open Source featuring economist Mark Blyth) show that this is just another example of an ugly, incorrect stereotype.
I agree; let us not forget that due to EU, Greeks got looser borrowing from banks, and they bought German products. Last time I was in Romania for a business trip, I saw a similar picture. Goods flow from Western Europe to Romania together with easy credit. That spoils people quickly.
Re: The average Greek is working a full 40% longer than the average German
#19That number is (more than) a bit misleading. I don't know where OECD pulls those numbers but it certainly doesn't feel as if Greeks work more than the average european. Shops dont work on sundays, public services are open for only a few hours a day, banks close at 2 etc. Underproductivity is a major issue, most of the work of public services is unnecessary red tape that could be easily automated if the government was willing.
Work hours is not our major problem, it's work ethics that are lacking. Hard work is not compensated, it is in fact frowned upon in the public sector, and this situation has even infiltrated much of the private sector. Absurd regulation and governmental dependencies has stifled competition in all but a few sectors (where it works it works reasonably well, such as telecommunications or banking). Couple that with a hostile investing environment and you have the perfect recipe for disaster.
That said, Greeks in general are industrious and entrepreneurial, but we tend to channel our inventiveness on finding ways to avoid paying taxes. Personally i believed from the start that Greece should have exited the euro in order to revitalize its dormant economy.
Re: The average Greek is working a full 40% longer than the average German
#20Time spent in work is not time spent working. All my greek buddies have a easy gong day. They are in work a number of hours, but how productive those hours are who knows.