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Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

thedrive.com

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Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#251

Post by undersuit »

avalys wrote: post #212
seanp2k2 wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Check out eg https://youtu.be/hmk5cxpAfcw where he’s flying by all the cars stuck in traffic on his human-powered peasant wheels. Auto companies lobbied governments and put out propaganda to get cities to rip out street cars and rail in the early 1900s. They did this to sell more cars, so this is what we get.

Your young and fit rollerblade dude doesn’t seem to be carrying much in the way of groceries or supervising any young children. What about the single mother of three with a disability? Should she push a cart to the grocery store? Who is watching her kids while she does this?

Why can't the majority of the people walk to a store and the rest can be serviced by a smaller truck?

Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#252

Post by Animatronio »

desas wrote: post #221
Animatronio wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was just thinking - why don't they make electrified coin-operated shopping carts that you can take home and return when you're done with them? That would greatly extend the carrying capacity of a single person and maybe make car trips redundant.

Because nearly no-one wants to walk to the store, walk home, walk back to the store to return the cart and then walk home again. I never drive to the store and I still wouldn't do that.

You'd keep the cart until next time you need it.

Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#253

Post by j-bos »

richjdsmith wrote: post #23

With the continued shift to EVs, petrol taxes just don't make sense as a form of taxation to pay for roads. I think we should be shifting entirely to a gross curb weight tax for all vehicles. The fourth power law states that the greater the axle load of a vehicle, the stress on the road caused by the motor vehicle increases in proportion to the fourth power of the axle load. Meaning heavier EVs cough hummer , are doi…

Why not just tax tires?

Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#254

Post by owlstuffing »

Kirby64 wrote: post #232
epivosism wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't the proper tax on tires? The more you shed, the faster they need replacement. So cars which shed a lot of microplastics would both use up more tires, AND would pay more tax. So as the tax increases we correctly linearly decrease tire use. It would be a mistake to over-punish EV users compared to ICE just because the average weight of an EV is heavier. (We know the weights, we don't need to average by class) Thi…

This is two different things though. Road use tax is intended to be used to pay for road maintenance and infrastructure. It's why if you live on a farm you can get tax-free diesel that is dyed red. You aren't using the road/infrastructure, so you shouldn't need to pay the tax. If the goal is to reduce tire microplastics, the tax should be specifically based on tire lifespan, which is already well known. It's called U…

>Today we tend to conflate tax…

Today we conflate supplying more of our earnings to the government and solutions to problems.

Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#255

Post by tmnvix »

baggy_trough wrote: post #236
TaylorAlexander wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But this is not an inherent property of cars. It is only true because we invested all our transit dollars in highways. Cars are not inherently better and roads are not free. If we invest more in public transit we can reduce our need for cars.

I'd like to know why you think cars are not inherently better as it seems very obvious that they are. That is why people overwhelmingly prefer to use them.

For a start, you have to store them at either end of your journey.

Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#256

Post by dlahoda »

badtension wrote: post #249
mlsu wrote: post #166

Has anyone here ever lived near a freeway or even moderately busy road? I made the mistake of renting next to the freeway. Noise was perfectly tolerable, but I could not use my back porch, because after just a few weeks, everything had a fine coating of black dust. I could not keep my windows open in the summer. I was certainly breathing this vile shit the entire time I lived there. This doesn't surprise me in the le…

That's why so many people are cautious about "EVs to save us all", to put it mildly. We are so focused on climate change and greenhouse gases that we do not see a lot of other issues and may exacerbate some of them in the process of decarbonisation.

EV bikes sure. price and weight of good EV bike dropped for last 5 years.

Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#257

Post by robocat »

baggy_trough wrote: post #186
mlsu wrote: post #166

Has anyone here ever lived near a freeway or even moderately busy road? I made the mistake of renting next to the freeway. Noise was perfectly tolerable, but I could not use my back porch, because after just a few weeks, everything had a fine coating of black dust. I could not keep my windows open in the summer. I was certainly breathing this vile shit the entire time I lived there. This doesn't surprise me in the le…

The positive externalities are even more enormous, which is a problem for environmentalists.

> positive externalities

I really don't think you meant to use the word externality here. And the other replies so far are not about positive externalities.

Perhaps roads are an indirect positive externality - roads are useful for bikes and buses, also useful for demarcation between properties or areas and addressing!!!

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/e/externality.asp

Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#258

Post by trgn »

nologic01 wrote: post #219

This is a strong a warning as any for people not to get too hang up on greenhouse gas emissions as the holy grail of sustainability. It creates the wrong mindset. What we have drifted into is a tech supported civilization that is covering the planet from corner to corner with myriad of footprints (emissions, particulate and chemical pollution of all types, habitat alteration or destruction etc). The story of ozon lay…

> Bold ideas are welcome. Burrying heads in the sand not an option.

It's simple. It's more mobility options, especially safe active transportation. EVs are still cars. It's a change in the margin. What is really needed is people biking, walking for their daily errands instead of using a car.

As for the safe part, it does not require anything special. The aspirational world of the future will be made real with bollards and trees. The american brain today cannot comprehend this. Yet it is a certainty.

Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#259

Post by globular-toast »

baggy_trough wrote: post #186
mlsu wrote: post #166

Has anyone here ever lived near a freeway or even moderately busy road? I made the mistake of renting next to the freeway. Noise was perfectly tolerable, but I could not use my back porch, because after just a few weeks, everything had a fine coating of black dust. I could not keep my windows open in the summer. I was certainly breathing this vile shit the entire time I lived there. This doesn't surprise me in the le…

The positive externalities are even more enormous, which is a problem for environmentalists.

Positive externalities? How does someone else driving a car possibly have a positive external effect?

Perhaps you don't know what an externality is. Congrats, you are one of today's lucky 10000.

Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#260

Post by TeMPOraL »

mplewis wrote: post #68
TeMPOraL wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In other words: you're proposing to replace a set of possible, if difficult, technological solutions, with an near-impossible social solution. I'd call that misguided. Technological solutions tend to be discussed because they can be implemented. Social solutions may work better, but only in imaginary la-la land where they can actually be put into practice. In the real world, you can't " just " get people to not drive…

Trains aren’t difficult technical solutions.

With trains, the hardware isn't the problem. The property rights are - specifically those of people owning land and real estate on, or near, the planned tracks. But it's still a possible (if uber expensive) problem - the government could eminent domain its way through. But expecting people to spontaneously abandon cars and demand trains? That is impossible in practice.
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