Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla • Hacker News Board

Re: Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

#591

Post by calfuris » Wed, Sep 06, 2023, 10:15 PM UTC

brewdad wrote: post #446

Loughla wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it's the same. You can control hidden things from the touch screen (like light length when opening the door for example) but most cars still have tactile nobs for everything outside of radio/bluetooth/media. There are some cars that have touchscreen for essential things like climate control, but those are absolutely in the minority.

Thing is, those cars with touch screen climate controls will let you set a temperature target much like your home thermostat. Once you figure out the right temperature, you don't really ever have to change it. I haven't changed the temperature in my car for months. I'll probably adjust it as summer turns to fall but it will be a one or two degree change one time and then I won't touch it again unless my kid drove the…

My current car (like all of the cars I've had since 2008) allows you to set a temperature target with physical controls. I don't change it as often as I changed the older direct controls, but I do change it often enough that I would hate to use a touchscreen for it.

Re: Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

#592

Post by SoftTalker » Wed, Sep 06, 2023, 10:24 PM UTC

ghaff wrote: post #445

SoftTalker wrote: post #397

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Automatics are more fuel efficient, and govenment keeps raising the efficiency requirements. Automatics do this by having a lot of gears and changing up very aggressively. It would suck to drive a 7 or 9 speed manual (maybe truck drivers feel differently; I think 5 is optimal for a car) but automatics can manage it and squeeeze out another tenth of an MPG. I love manual transmissions and will never buy an automatic u…

I assume the efficiency requirements are why my car doesn't provide a way to permanently turn off the auto idle start/stop. The button's to temporarily disable it is convenient enough to make it something of a reflex. But it's a feature I really don't like when I'm making an unprotected left hand turn for example.

My wife's car has that; I find that if I stop and keep my foot very lightly on the brake, just enough to stop the car rolling, it doesn't shut the engine off. If I step more firmly on the brake while I'm stopped, it shuts the engine off.

Also some of the diagnostic scanners will have a way to disable the auto stop/start, or so I've heard. I have a scanner but haven't tried it on her car.

Re: Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

#593

Post by artursapek » Wed, Sep 06, 2023, 10:25 PM UTC

TedDoesntTalk wrote: post #60

artursapek wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you buy a good used car from the first decade of the 2000s or earlier

Is that your solution 20 years from now, too?

20 years from now there will be companies making dumbcars just like there are starting to with phones right now

Re: Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

#594

Post by jancsika » Wed, Sep 06, 2023, 10:28 PM UTC

dangus wrote: post #426

EricE wrote: post #390

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"A reminder that driving isn’t a right" It is in America. Our constitution constrains the government, it doesn't grant us rights - we already have them as human beings. I can't imagine living under a cynical government that has that equation flipped but obviously you've been conditioned to accept it.

That’s just plain factually incorrect. You aren’t allowed to drive unless you pass a written and driving test in all 50 states, with only a few exceptions like agricultural use. The default state of your rights in the USA is that you are not allowed to drive. It is effectively an additive privilege that you have to go out of your way to obtain. The constitution doesn’t restrict the government’s ability to regulate th…

Is there a fantasy map of the U.S. with mass transit lines and associated cost?

Hell, I'd even love to look at such a fantasy map for Atlanta, GA where Marta is built out throw all that crazy Atlantan sprawl...

Re: Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

#595

Post by Ylpertnodi » Wed, Sep 06, 2023, 10:36 PM UTC

PrimeMcFly wrote: post #509

throw3747874747 wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am pretty sure that is (or soon will be) illegal in EU. Car needs to be able to call emergency, if accident is detected.

What about the the numerous older cars that don't have that functionality?

Eventually, there will be no older cars left. The 'agencies' are thinking of the future, unlike the governments (ever have done, long term).

Re: Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

#596

Post by noman-land » Wed, Sep 06, 2023, 10:44 PM UTC

orev wrote: post #139

noman-land wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Check out the manual, find where the fuse is for the cellular modem, and remove it.

That’s quite a big assumption to think that it would be clearly labeled, and also that it would have a dedicated fuse. It’s not like that would be such a huge power draw that it needs its own fuse. Pulling the fuse would likely cause the whole infotainment system to go down.

Reading back at my reply, I didn't mean it to sound so authoritative. Just an idea.

I helped a friend do this a couple years ago in a fairly modern car. It most certainly was not clearly labeled, but there were clues that led us to try it out. It indeed disabled more than just the cellular modem but the goal was to disable all "smart" features altogether, along with anything that collects telemetry or phones home. After monitoring how it affected the car, the mild trade-offs were deemed worth it.

Re: Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

#597

Post by FireBeyond » Wed, Sep 06, 2023, 10:58 PM UTC

falcolas wrote: post #488

sergiosgc wrote: post #455

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is true, but only in automatic mode. In semi-automatic, everything is quite predictable, no?

Predictable, usually. Lag free? Not in my experience. Most of the time there’s a good quarter to half second between requesting the shift and the transmission acting. For me at least, that lag is very effective at disconnecting me from the experience of driving.

I challenge you to dual clutch a shift change in 135ms like an RS 5 does in semi auto.

Re: Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

#598

Post by FireBeyond » Wed, Sep 06, 2023, 11:31 PM UTC

troyvit wrote: post #418

Workaccount2 wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a fair point though. The markups are a function of demand and are totally normal and expected market behavior. People who complain about it are almost exclusively people who don't understand how markets work. It's tiring listening to uneducated people constantly coming through and complaining. If dealers weren't marking up the price, there would be no car at all available for sale. People mistakenly think that i…

I have to agree, at least to a point. Nine times out of ten a person buying a car doesn't need it right away. Therefore if they don't like the mark-up they can just come back later when the market changes. If everybody did that then demand would go down and then so would the mark-up.

What? Apparently car accidents aren’t a thing near you. “Nine times out of ten” is a wholly made up and entirely inaccurate estimation.

“Sure, someone just totaled my car but I can “just come back later when the market changes”.”

Re: Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

#599

Post by FireBeyond » Wed, Sep 06, 2023, 11:36 PM UTC

brandonagr2 wrote: post #269

tristor wrote: post #132

Of all the horrible things go on with privacy these days, this is the one I hate the most. I’m a “car guy”, but not the sort that obsesses over old cars (although I do love 60s and 80s cars). I like new tech, I like the advances in engineering we’ve made in new vehicles, I like EVs even. Nonetheless I’ve been in the market for a new car for months and haven’t bought because it’s hard to find any cars that meet my req…

If you want best in class safety tech and no dealer markups, you can just order a Tesla online

“Best in class” safety tech…

No, Teslas have a specific safety rating.

In the Luxury Sedan segment with the same safety rating are 13 other vehicles.

In the Luxury SUV segment there are 19.

“In a high safety class” is accurate, but there’s nothing in those ratings to say the Tesla is the safest of them.

Re: Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

#600

Post by Night_Thastus » Thu, Sep 07, 2023, 1:12 AM UTC

thfuran wrote: post #587

Night_Thastus wrote: post #583

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the insurance company would get very suspicious if you never used your car. Also with no data, you'd get no benefit for showing you're a safe driver. In theory, you could maybe reduce your rate by only taking this second phone with you only sometimes on a regular, but lesser schedule than you actually drive. (So they see regular, consistent usage, but not nothing, and not as much as you actually drive) And av…

>you'd get no benefit for showing you're a safe driver. But is that actually how it works or are they discounting for the absence of evidence of being an unsafe driver?

They look at how you drive. How far you drive, how often you drive, when you drive, how quickly you brake/accelerate, how often you're on your phone, etc. Based on all those factors - they give you a discount relative to what they'd charge normally.

I can say that's true because their rate was already less than competitors, so it's not like they were charging a higher rate and then 'discounting' back to normal.