Sam: "Please regulate AI"
EU: "Ok then"
Sam: "No, not like that"
Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation
171–180 of 210 posts
Re: Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation
#172I've spoken to many people in the USA that are anti-union and anti-regulation. The impression they have is that regulation is used to stomp out small businesses (and unions have some propensity for corruption). The EU regulation does not come with the same feelings, aside from the very aggressive FUD around GDPR. EU regulation is typically seen as something for the consumer/public good and not intended to stifle comp…
Feelings from whom? Because for sure that's a very common feeling in Europe about EU regulations. It was a big part of the political campaigning around Brexit, even. You even admit this - nobody feels this way, except for the people who very strongly feel that way but their feelings are "FUD" so don't count?
it is literal fear, uncertainty, and doubt.
GDPR often gets blown out of all proportion by people who seem to have a vested interest in having the regulation scrapped.
This played out the same with the EU cookie directive which was intended to give people consent on how they were tracked- with massive carve outs for legitimate use, the intention was that people would cut down on that tracking to avoid needing a popup; but ended up in some form of malicious compliance where everyone just put up pop-ups instead and tried to hide the opt-out with dark patterns.. massively overblowing what the regulation even entailed in the first place by claiming that the pop-up was necessary.
Re: Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation
#173Earlier quoted context omitted.
why else would anyone want it?
Anyone with an ounce of consideration for others will want regulation, on any sbuject. Otherwise, we'd be driving around doing 150 in cities.
speed limits and seat belts didn't come from the auto industry, it came from people lobbying for regulation that benefited them
Re: Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation
#174Earlier quoted context omitted.
Of course, because vast variety of businesses had no security whatsoever and a bunch of PII could just be accessed by anyone on file share. Vast majority of cases are "we haven't even tried in the first place" And majority of fines are in range of 4 to low 5 digit. At least from what I observed the "mistakes" are generally fined pretty low if organization can prove it took necessary steps in goodwill, but stuff like…
One of the small businesses in question wanted to use Shopify and got fined.
Then use provider that respects privacy. You guys would give up your rights for a pack of chips..
Re: Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation
#175Earlier quoted context omitted.
One of the small businesses in question wanted to use Shopify and got fined.
Then use provider that respects privacy. You guys would give up your rights for a pack of chips..
It’s funny for someone to claim that we would give up our rights when you are begging the government to limit your choices instead of using your own free will to choose based on your priorities.
The EU is constantly taking away your right to choose which companies you want to use and it’s being celebrated
Re: Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation
#176Earlier quoted context omitted.
> If hypothetically no AI can be created with respecting the citizens The problem is you're assuming the people writing the regulations are perfect. It's not that bad AI should exist, it's that we're probably at least a decade away from regulators even having a hope of starting to understand what's going on.
Why should I assume anything? We are what we are and we do what we can with what we have - imperfect as it is. Inactivity is way worse. By the way understanding all things (AI or whatever) is definitely not a requirement for the legislators. I'm sure you remember they have hordes of specialists in their staff and those will understand the aspects at hand to sketch recommendations.
It's not legislators, although I disagree with your assessment there. The people actually doing assessments and inspections of companies do not have much expertise at all. Even for far simpler technical tasks than assessing AI.
Re: Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation
#177Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm still waiting for Google/Facebook to leave Europe. Never seems to happen, despite the incessant whining. Maybe the fines were not heavy enough.
Paying a billion dollars per year in fines is still cheaper for Facebook than leaving the EU.
shrug at least they pay tax now even if in weird way...
Re: Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation
#178Earlier quoted context omitted.
They may seem obvious to you, but to a lot of us, it's not obvious at all. Vague notions of "damage" could refer to anything, like harming competition. Different value systems and all that.
Well, the original post was "Stop me if you can." Basically, if there's no rule saying I can't do it, then I should do it, until rules are developed to stop it; regardless of the morality or danger. I suspect that one way to make people more careful, is to make future rules and regulations retroactive. For example, if I had developed a fintech product that was a legal ponzi scheme, or a downloader that is a legal way…
> if the new remedies can be applied to the "legal" implementations that were in effect before the closing of the loopholes, I suspect that it would make the "loopholer" a wee bit more cautious.
and there's moral implications about applying new rules retroactively. What you do today that is completely legal, should not be punished tomorrow even if it was decided in the future that it is illegal. Otherwise, there would be a chilling effect on innovation.
Re: Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation
#179Earlier quoted context omitted.
By proclaiming they'd leave if they can't comply, it might cause the EU regulators to "self-censor" the regulation such that it's "easy to comply". but tbh, i dont see what the regulations would be. I am a fan of no regulation unless actual harm has been shown first.
This is a nonsensical statement. All markets, and thus all goods sold on a market are regulated. You can’t have markets without regulations.
You're not making a point on the argument being made.
It's not about _not_ having regulations. It's about not introducing new regulations without demonstrating harm first.
The current crop of regulations, i argue, is sufficient, and no new ones introduced for AI.
Re: Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation
#180Earlier quoted context omitted.
By proclaiming they'd leave if they can't comply, it might cause the EU regulators to "self-censor" the regulation such that it's "easy to comply". but tbh, i dont see what the regulations would be. I am a fan of no regulation unless actual harm has been shown first.
As quoted in the article: > He called for some regulation “between the traditional European approach and the traditional U.S. approach,” whatever that means. And you phrase it: > I am a fan of no regulation unless actual harm has been shown first. This is the "traditional US approach". As has been shown far too often, by the time actual harm has been shown, it is far too late. Especially as large industries like to u…
And yet, the empirical results is that the US is now wealthier than the EU (at least, in totality).
And not to mention that such regulations (on AI) might not be adhered to by countries such as China, which would make it all but moot - except it causes harm to western companies looking to profit.
A cautious approach is valid only if you have unlimited budget and you are not in a natural darwinian selection process of elimination.