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Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation

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Re: Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation

#61

Post by avidphantasm »

chii wrote: post #20
jeroenhd wrote: post #5

> If we can comply, we will, and if we can’t, we’ll cease operating… We will try. But there are technical limits to what’s possible. Isn't that what any normal company does? Comply until it's impossible to operate legally? They can choose between ceasing to operate or getting arrested. If the AI regulations are reasonable and AI companies can't operate, the technology just isn't ready for wide-spread adoption yet. Se…

By proclaiming they'd leave if they can't comply, it might cause the EU regulators to "self-censor" the regulation such that it's "easy to comply". but tbh, i dont see what the regulations would be. I am a fan of no regulation unless actual harm has been shown first.

This is a nonsensical statement. All markets, and thus all goods sold on a market are regulated. You can’t have markets without regulations.

Re: Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation

#62

Post by ho_schi »

chii wrote: post #20
jeroenhd wrote: post #5

> If we can comply, we will, and if we can’t, we’ll cease operating… We will try. But there are technical limits to what’s possible. Isn't that what any normal company does? Comply until it's impossible to operate legally? They can choose between ceasing to operate or getting arrested. If the AI regulations are reasonable and AI companies can't operate, the technology just isn't ready for wide-spread adoption yet. Se…

By proclaiming they'd leave if they can't comply, it might cause the EU regulators to "self-censor" the regulation such that it's "easy to comply". but tbh, i dont see what the regulations would be. I am a fan of no regulation unless actual harm has been shown first.

    … no regulation unless actual harm has been shown first.
What?

It is the duty of politics to protect the citizens and environment - also proactively. From reckless CEOs, greedy shareholders and lawyers which claim that it wasn’t strictly forbidden to cause harm.

Politics isn’t doing always right. The Cookie-Directive tried to make misuse of Cookies illegal. Actually it made web browsing horrible and created further questionable businesses like “cookie cloud storage providers aggregating cookies of several websites”.

On the other hand this people require ABS and ESP in cars. Banned Teslas “Autopilot” and had smart ideas like type certification for aircraft’s. And then they forbid stuff which can cause cancer…that was smart! What comes next? Acting against monopolies and oligopolies like Microsoft and Apple?

Re: Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation

#63

Post by jcfrei »

In traditional European fashion the EU is again likely to crush any emerging European AI venture with overburdening regulation while companies in the US flourish. For decades now the American approach of wait and see has proven superior (with few exceptions for sectors like pharmaceuticals). When the government waits with regulation until more clarity has been established to what the actual business models are going to be like then you give companies a chance to establish themselves versus the old ones. The European approach just scares new companies off and they'll try out their new ventures in different jurisdictions.

Re: Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation

#65

Post by themitigating »

eterevsky wrote: post #26
jeroenhd wrote: post #5

> If we can comply, we will, and if we can’t, we’ll cease operating… We will try. But there are technical limits to what’s possible. Isn't that what any normal company does? Comply until it's impossible to operate legally? They can choose between ceasing to operate or getting arrested. If the AI regulations are reasonable and AI companies can't operate, the technology just isn't ready for wide-spread adoption yet. Se…

> If the AI regulations are reasonable and AI companies can't operate, the technology just isn't ready for wide-spread adoption yet. Conversely if the AI system is reasonable, but the regulations are making them illegal, then the blame is on the regulations. There is a trade-off between potential benefits and potential harm, and it's not immediately clear to me, who is in the better position to find it: the AI compan…

So it's subjective right? The balance.

Since a company is usually harmed by increased regulation their opinion is biased.

But there's no oppposite to this. Governments don't benefit if companies leave and in fact they lose out. This also includes the population (jobs etc) that means the opinion of the government isn't biased.

Re: Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation

#66

Post by themitigating »

chii wrote: post #20
jeroenhd wrote: post #5

> If we can comply, we will, and if we can’t, we’ll cease operating… We will try. But there are technical limits to what’s possible. Isn't that what any normal company does? Comply until it's impossible to operate legally? They can choose between ceasing to operate or getting arrested. If the AI regulations are reasonable and AI companies can't operate, the technology just isn't ready for wide-spread adoption yet. Se…

By proclaiming they'd leave if they can't comply, it might cause the EU regulators to "self-censor" the regulation such that it's "easy to comply". but tbh, i dont see what the regulations would be. I am a fan of no regulation unless actual harm has been shown first.

Why wait until harm occurs to regulate?

Re: Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation

#67

Post by matthewmacleod »

sokoloff wrote: post #44
nrtlal wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like paulg, but in one of his essays he complained about jocks stealing the Nerds' lunch money and that software engineering was a way to avoid the jocks. Now, his protege is attempting to steal the Nerds' lunch money with CoPilot.

What do Sam or pg have to do with CoPilot?

Copilot is powered by OpenAI Codex

Re: Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation

#68

Post by themitigating »

bionhoward wrote: post #60
ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I am a fan of no regulation unless actual harm has been shown first. I used to be, but some of the modern crop of CEOs has taken the wind out of that. They have done tremendous damage, very quickly, and the regulation has been unable to keep up, until severe damage has already been done. Once the bullet has left the gun, it can't be stuffed back in.

Can you be more specific, with examples? Who did what?

You need an example of a bad thing happening because regulations didn't exist?

Re: Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation

#69

Post by ChatGTP »

nrtlal wrote: post #38
naillo wrote: post #33

Paulg complaining about the EU regulations while ignoring Sams congress hearing is just a crazy contrast and hypocricy to me.

I like paulg, but in one of his essays he complained about jocks stealing the Nerds' lunch money and that software engineering was a way to avoid the jocks. Now, his protege is attempting to steal the Nerds' lunch money with CoPilot.

I've always felt like AI is the ultimate nerd revenge. I still kind of do. Except I like this framing, the nerds are trying to take each others lunch money now too :)

Re: Sam Altman Says OpenAI Will Leave the EU If There's Any Real AI Regulation

#70

Post by fallingknife »

ho_schi wrote: post #62
chii wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By proclaiming they'd leave if they can't comply, it might cause the EU regulators to "self-censor" the regulation such that it's "easy to comply". but tbh, i dont see what the regulations would be. I am a fan of no regulation unless actual harm has been shown first.

… no regulation unless actual harm has been shown first. What? It is the duty of politics to protect the citizens and environment - also proactively. From reckless CEOs, greedy shareholders and lawyers which claim that it wasn’t strictly forbidden to cause harm. Politics isn’t doing always right. The Cookie-Directive tried to make misuse of Cookies illegal. Actually it made web browsing horrible and created further q…

Regulation without known harm is a case of we need to do something and this is something. The rules will be arbitrary and expensive to comply with and will most likely have no preventative effect on any negative effects.
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