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Downtown SF has 18.4M square feet of empty office space. We mapped every vacancy

sfchronicle.com

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Re: Downtown SF has 18.4M square feet of empty office space. We mapped every vacancy

#71

Isn't there a housing shortage? Rezone these buildings for apartments on the upper floors. Edit: Even if it costs a lot to convert (that is where tax incentives would usually help if done correctly). Having them sit empty costs more eventually.

Renovating commercial office space for residential use would be very expensive. Just re-plumbing alone would not be cheep. Probably cheaper than building a brand new building, but I don't know the numbers on that.

Re: Downtown SF has 18.4M square feet of empty office space. We mapped every vacancy

#72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I share one thought about this, which is I don't want my tax dollars supporting red state policies, in essence, and I wonder if OP feels the same way

[flagged]

Funny you say that, because not only do 'red' states have higher crime rates than 'blue' states[0], but 'red' cities within those red states, like Jacksonville or Oklahoma City, also have higher crime rates.[1]

[0]https://www.thirdway.org/report/the-two-decade-red-state-mur...

[1]https://www.newsweek.com/these-republican-cities-have-higher...

Re: Downtown SF has 18.4M square feet of empty office space. We mapped every vacancy

#73

I live in SF and spend a fair amount of time thinking about its poor 5-year economic outlook. It's not great, but I am curious how it compares to other metros? If I were to move from SF, wanted to live in a metro area, and was uncomfortable living in a very red state - where should I consider? Where is thriving? I have a good amount of friends in Portland, but Portland is adjacent SF in terms of poor economic recover…

Miami is booming but I do fear the Californian migrants there will just turn it into another San Francisco in due time.

In what way(s)?

Re: Downtown SF has 18.4M square feet of empty office space. We mapped every vacancy

#74

I live in SF and spend a fair amount of time thinking about its poor 5-year economic outlook. It's not great, but I am curious how it compares to other metros? If I were to move from SF, wanted to live in a metro area, and was uncomfortable living in a very red state - where should I consider? Where is thriving? I have a good amount of friends in Portland, but Portland is adjacent SF in terms of poor economic recover…

Living in big cities within "red" states is not like living in the state itself outside the city, other than you are all affected by the same state laws (unless the latter is the main concern). Atlanta GA, Austin TX, etc. are all "blue in a sea of red" as they say. Lived in the former myself for many years. Yes you're affected by state laws, but most of the folks in large cities are going to be less like the stereoty…

Unfortunately, this is becoming less and less true as GOP-run states strip autonomy from cities and steadily increase state control over them. Take Texas as an example,[0] where they've banned cities from

  -enacting paid sick leave

  -enacting mandatory heat and water breaks for manual labor jobs

  -modifying their police budgets

  -restricting fracking within city limits

  -restricting greenhouse gas-intense products
Among other things.

[0]https://www.ksat.com/news/texas/2023/04/18/texas-house-appro...

Re: Downtown SF has 18.4M square feet of empty office space. We mapped every vacancy

#75
post #29

I live in SF and spend a fair amount of time thinking about its poor 5-year economic outlook. It's not great, but I am curious how it compares to other metros? If I were to move from SF, wanted to live in a metro area, and was uncomfortable living in a very red state - where should I consider? Where is thriving? I have a good amount of friends in Portland, but Portland is adjacent SF in terms of poor economic recover…

San Diego perhaps?

In terms of density, San Diego is like a stretched out San Francisco. The best places to live are along the coastline and an ocean view is very expensive. My tiny condo, with a view, has a higher cost per sq. foot than $3m victorians in San Francisco.

But you're right, at this point, I'd still rather be in SD than SF.

Re: Downtown SF has 18.4M square feet of empty office space. We mapped every vacancy

#76
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless you are the owner/lessor of commercial real estate, why does this matter? NYC is happening these days, even if not everyone is going back to the office every day. They're still here in their homes (which are renting out for record high rates) and going about their daily lives in the city, which is absolutely packed.

But downtown SF has always been like a scene out of "Night of the Comet" compared to NY.

Look, I'm not gonna argue with you that NYC has always been better than SF (it obviously has), but post-pandemic now the difference is even more stark. NYC's economy is much more diverse than SF's, and also has much more housing within city limits, to the point that it hasn't suffered nearly as much from the pandemic, and indeed right now is booming whereas SF is withering.

Re: Downtown SF has 18.4M square feet of empty office space. We mapped every vacancy

#77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Funny you say that, because not only do 'red' states have higher crime rates than 'blue' states[0], but 'red' cities within those red states, like Jacksonville or Oklahoma City, also have higher crime rates.[1] [0] https://www.thirdway.org/report/the-two-decade-red-state-mur... [1] https://www.newsweek.com/these-republican-cities-have-higher...

[flagged]

Re: Downtown SF has 18.4M square feet of empty office space. We mapped every vacancy

#78

I live in SF and spend a fair amount of time thinking about its poor 5-year economic outlook. It's not great, but I am curious how it compares to other metros? If I were to move from SF, wanted to live in a metro area, and was uncomfortable living in a very red state - where should I consider? Where is thriving? I have a good amount of friends in Portland, but Portland is adjacent SF in terms of poor economic recover…

Personal politics, IMO, is not a good reason to avoid living in certain areas. I'm a liberal-leaning moderate but many of my favorite people (friends and family) are conservative, and many of my hobbies tend to be populated mainly by the conservative demographic. You'll always find people here and there who won't give you the time of day if you're not on Team Blue or Team Red, but my take on it is, if I can't make friends with people who hold beliefs different from my own, then maybe I'm the asshole.

That said, if it really matters that much to you, you'll find plenty of swing states with mid-sized cities in the Midwest. Upsides are low cost of living, 20 minutes from the center of the city to cornfields. Downsides are you can't go too far north if you don't like cold winters.

No area is thriving right now thanks to the recession, but it sounds like you are aiming for remote work anyway, so why does that matter? If I were in your shoes, I would pick a place that has the geography, climate, and cost of living I am looking for and not worry so much about the politics and economic prospects of the area.

Re: Downtown SF has 18.4M square feet of empty office space. We mapped every vacancy

#79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly; the tech companies in SF didn't have the backbone to require RTO like the finance firms in NYC did. The cities' respective recoveries show that the finance firms made the right call.

lol people would just move jobs to keep working remote. That's the beauty of working in tech. There's a lot of companies to move over to. Finance is a lot more restricted.

And, interestingly enough, an increasing number of people have moved to NYC to work remotely from here. Living in NYC is a legitimate attraction in its own right, and is appealing to a lot of people even if they're not working here.
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