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PornHub blocks users in Utah, cites state’s age verification law

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Re: PornHub blocks users in Utah, cites state’s age verification law

#381

Post by robertlagrant »

Auracle wrote: post #154
robertlagrant wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this much different to a shop needing ID to sell a pornographic magazine, to avoid selling it to a minor?

Sure, but the store wouldn’t keep a database keeping track of exactly what porn you bought. It’s also like having stores check IDs when other porn is just floating by on the wind with regularity. Even if all of the major porn websites did checks there’s still Twitter, Telegram, Reddit, Google/Bing image search, torrents…

> It’s also like having stores check IDs when other porn is just floating by on the wind with regularity

I suppose this does indeed happen, if you count the internet as the wind.

Re: PornHub blocks users in Utah, cites state’s age verification law

#382

Post by wkat4242 »

intrasight wrote: post #294
berkes wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But is pornography dangerous for minors? Has it been researched? What "dangers" are there? Do these apply to all age groups of "minors"?

Pornography is that which harms the soul. That's true of all people not just minors. The question then becomes what should be classified as pornography. Justice Stewart famously said "I know it when I see it". My definition is close: "pornography is that which harms my soul". That means that what is porn will differ for different people and probably by age as well.

Then don't watch it. Let us have ours.

Re: PornHub blocks users in Utah, cites state’s age verification law

#383

Post by loeg »

Simulacra wrote: post #253
Eisenstein wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It seems most people recognize that the proliferation of easily-available porn has been a detriment to society I have not heard of this consensus. Where can I find out about it?

Do you think porn has been good for society?

I certainly don't think it has been a detriment, which was your original claimed consensus viewpoint. (You have since moved the goalposts).

Re: PornHub blocks users in Utah, cites state’s age verification law

#384

Post by RajT88 »

taylodl wrote: post #190

An identity provider can make verified age one of the claims on an OAuth token. It removes anonymity, but at least you don't have to provide your personal details to everybody on the internet demanding age verification. You provide those details to your trusted identity provider, they provide the claim of your age to the website. With that in place we can easily make beer, liquor, marijuana and tobacco sales on the i…

> but at least you don't have to provide your personal details to everybody on the internet demanding age verification.

I think some of the aim of these bills is to shame people into not consuming vice.

Re: PornHub blocks users in Utah, cites state’s age verification law

#385

Post by robertlagrant »

brookst wrote: post #244
Marsymars wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> For instance, jail parents whose minor children view pornography. Does this seem at all practical to you? To me, this seems akin to dropping ID requirements at liquor stores and bars, and instead enacting a law to jail the parents of minors who drink liquor.

Well, we jail parents who abuse their children. And if viewing pornography is so dangerous to children that it justifies restricting speech for everyone, surely that is such a compelling interest that we should punish parents who allow it to happen. Which is all to say, no. None of this is workable because none of this is about protecting children from life-altering harm. This law is intended to create a liabikity tr…

> it justifies restricting speech for everyone

I don't believe everyone considers pornography to be speech, let alone practices it as speech.

Re: PornHub blocks users in Utah, cites state’s age verification law

#386

Post by Aachen »

eldritch_4ier wrote: post #305
berkes wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But is pornography dangerous for minors? Has it been researched? What "dangers" are there? Do these apply to all age groups of "minors"?

It’s probably about as dangerous to minors as sitting the minor in a room while 2 consenting adults have sex, or taking that minor to a strip club. Does the screen itself prevent trauma? Would you be ok with having your child exposed to either of these? What about a gentle and loving uncle molesting a child in a way not much different from playful wrestling? Wrestling is fine, but we all recognize the molestation is…

GP was asking precisely because it is not common sense.

Re: PornHub blocks users in Utah, cites state’s age verification law

#387

Post by loeg »

bumby wrote: post #362
loeg wrote: post #354

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't read GP's mind, but sugar doesn't require ID verification to buy in the state of Utah, for example.

They might if sugar was able to be consumed for free with virtually unlimited access. I'm not sure it's a very good analogy.

It more or less is? It's extremely inexpensive.

Re: PornHub blocks users in Utah, cites state’s age verification law

#388

Post by mind-blight »

rchaud wrote: post #298
theclansman wrote: post #182

Just the fact that pornography is being taken seriously as something that's dangerous for minors is a good thing really.

That is something that your parents or community elders could have told you. Why does the state need to intervene? Phub is also a legitimate business that has commercial advertising interests in the US, so they're incentivized to play nice. There are about a million other websites that aren't based in North America, contain only pirated material, and don't care about what laws are applicable where.

PornHub refused to take down child porn and rape videos (not actors, actual assaults) on their platform for years. They only took them down when the victims in the videos took them to court and the NYT published an exposé. They're in the middle of being sued right now, and the evidence that's coming to light in that case is pretty damning.

Given how poorly they've behaved so far, I don't agree that they're incentivized to play nice.

Re: PornHub blocks users in Utah, cites state’s age verification law

#389

Post by woeirua »

eatsyourtacos wrote: post #342
woeirua wrote: post #302

It makes no sense to me that every physical store in a state must check IDs if you want to buy porn or alcohol, but porn websites can just let anyone in without checking ID. There are legitimate privacy concerns with checking ID online, but I think it’s way past time that the government does something to restrict the supply of porn to minors via the internet. The same with social media. The evidence that social media…

>It makes no sense to me that every physical store in a state must check IDs if you want to buy porn or alcohol, but porn websites can just let anyone in without checking ID. So.. what, you have to enter a license number or a picture of a license to let people into a porn website? How does that prove anything other than someone has access to a license number/picture? >There are legitimate privacy concerns with checki…

> So.. what, you have to enter a license number or a picture of a license to let people into a porn website? How does that prove anything other than someone has access to a license number/picture?

It's still a barrier to entry and will stop some kids. Sure, kids can still get fake IDs or use their parents so this wont stop everyone but no law ever will stop everyone.

> First... how?

Don't know. Let's let the people who have the most interest here figure out a workable way around this.

> Second.. I sure as shit don't want that. Most people don't want that. Mostly religious nutjobs do, and politicians pretend like they care just to keep on good terms with religious nuts.

You may not. But I'm not a religious nut job, in fact I'm a frequent user of online porn and have for almost 20 years now. That said, I think I'm mature enough now to recognize how fucked up a lot of stuff online is. And now that I have kids, I can see that the status quo is probably not where we want to be on this issue. Not necessarily for my kids (I can put strong content filtering on my networks), but for other people who aren't nearly as tech savvy.

> I'm not advocating for social media here- but no one being objective about the subject would ever speak that way. You obviously have a "PROTECT THE CHILDREN!" mentality and want to legislate everything with no respect to anything else. At least just be straight forward instead of trying to make silly arguments.

Looks pretty compelling to me: https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3919760

Re: PornHub blocks users in Utah, cites state’s age verification law

#390

Post by Longlius »

theclansman wrote: post #182

Just the fact that pornography is being taken seriously as something that's dangerous for minors is a good thing really.

I think it's good, but I really wish the solution was, "We need parents to take a more active role in their children's lives and supervise their internet usage" and not, "Lockdown and de-anonymize the web."
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