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New York to ban natural gas, including stoves, in new buildings

nytimes.com

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Re: New York to ban natural gas, including stoves, in new buildings

#121

Post by [deleted] »

downut wrote: post #116
mkinsella wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. An induction cooktop and electric stove are far superior to gas.

I am curious how one pops popcorn, shakes a pan, throws the pan, and heats the sides of the pan when eg reducing stock. How do woks work, exactly, on an induction burner? Why does spilling liquids cause the problems I encountered? Why does the bottom of the pans have to be perfectly flat? Some of my cast iron skillets (whoops never mind) are 50 years or more old and are not perfectly flat. They cook fantastic on a ga…

[deleted]

Re: New York to ban natural gas, including stoves, in new buildings

#122

Post by zmgsabst »

dragonwriter wrote: post #98
zmgsabst wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> Most third world countries don’t allow organized crime Depending on whether you mean de jure or de facto when you say “allow”, this is either not a difference or not true.

> organized crime and persistent retail theft the way SF does

Those were in a single grouping.

I’m currently in SE Asia: factually, they don’t allow organized retail theft akin to what I’ve seen in Seattle or SF.

Their downtowns also aren’t littered with drug zombies.

Re: New York to ban natural gas, including stoves, in new buildings

#123

Post by binarycrusader »

rcme wrote: post #78
stathibus wrote: post #2

Everyone is worked up about losing their gas stove, but natural gas heating is far more reliable and efficient than any electric option right now. This will create a lot of issues until heat pumps catch up. Northern New York is very cold.

Heat Pumps can run in very cold temperatures, but it's just not worth it, economically, because their efficiency drops and gas becomes a cheaper option.

It is not always a cheaper option. Especially, if for example, you don’t have natural gas service at all currently. In some areas of Seattle there is no natural gas service and so homes may be all electric if newer, or if older may only have oil heating.

Also, I know you likely didn’t mean to exclude this, but in cases where gas service might be cheaper in the short term that’s only because it’s effectively heavily subsidized and many of the costs are externalized.

Re: New York to ban natural gas, including stoves, in new buildings

#124

Post by peteradio »

0xdead8ead wrote: post #114
someonehere wrote: post #22

Berkeley attempted this and it was recently overturned: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/court-overturns-berkeley-califo... California's electric grid is in horrendous shape. We can barely keep the power on in the summertime, especially when wildfires happen. When the power is out, am I expected to start a fire in my yard to cook food? Fire up my JetBoil? My BBQ?

Eugene tried this as well. City council passed it without input from the community and is facing backlash. Since the 9th circuit decision, the ordinance has been called into question. https://www.bendbulletin.com/business/eugene-s-natural-gas-b... The community has since generated enough signatures to put the ban to a public vote that will be voted on in November. Anecdotally, I'd say, most my neighbors are against t…

Eugene is way past its prime unfortunately. There used to be a giant festering pit in the middle of downtown, now it looks worse.

Re: New York to ban natural gas, including stoves, in new buildings

#126

Post by mcculley »

hedora wrote: post #85
someonehere wrote: post #22

Berkeley attempted this and it was recently overturned: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/court-overturns-berkeley-califo... California's electric grid is in horrendous shape. We can barely keep the power on in the summertime, especially when wildfires happen. When the power is out, am I expected to start a fire in my yard to cook food? Fire up my JetBoil? My BBQ?

Most people around here buy enough battery or generators to keep the power on. PG&E is way below one nine of availability this year, but the outlets inside our house are at 6 nines followed by an eight. Granted, once the propane rationing started, a few of our neighbors lost power for extended periods of time (weeks). The phone company doesn’t maintain internet if the power is out, but there is starlink, and fiber co…

> Most people around here buy enough battery or generators to keep the power on.

This is a surprising assertion to me. How can “most people” afford batteries and generators?

Re: New York to ban natural gas, including stoves, in new buildings

#127

Post by fafqg »

downut wrote: post #116
mkinsella wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. An induction cooktop and electric stove are far superior to gas.

I am curious how one pops popcorn, shakes a pan, throws the pan, and heats the sides of the pan when eg reducing stock. How do woks work, exactly, on an induction burner? Why does spilling liquids cause the problems I encountered? Why does the bottom of the pans have to be perfectly flat? Some of my cast iron skillets (whoops never mind) are 50 years or more old and are not perfectly flat. They cook fantastic on a ga…

[flagged]

Re: New York to ban natural gas, including stoves, in new buildings

#128

Post by seneca »

bhk wrote: post #83
rayiner wrote: post #17

And NPR told me that the possibility of gas stoves being banned was fake outrage: https://www.npr.org/2023/01/20/1150228734/the-facts-and-stra... .

Not just NPR. Republicans Mocked Over Outraged Claims Government 'Coming for' Gas Stoves https://www.newsweek.com/republicans-mocked-over-outraged-cl... "... the rightwing immolation at the mere suggestion of a gas stove ban is just one more line on a long list of rightwing lies made for political gain." https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/jan/18/how-di... As usual, "That's not going to happen!" gives way…

It's called The Law of Merited Impossibility. It's a popular tactic for authoritarians in the last 30 years or so. Deny something is happening, and anyone who claims it is is paranoid. Then quickly do the thing, and smear anyone who says it's a bad thing. The point is to avoid ever actually debating the ideas they're pushing by denying it.

Re: New York to ban natural gas, including stoves, in new buildings

#129

Post by ecshafer »

downut wrote: post #116
mkinsella wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. An induction cooktop and electric stove are far superior to gas.

I am curious how one pops popcorn, shakes a pan, throws the pan, and heats the sides of the pan when eg reducing stock. How do woks work, exactly, on an induction burner? Why does spilling liquids cause the problems I encountered? Why does the bottom of the pans have to be perfectly flat? Some of my cast iron skillets (whoops never mind) are 50 years or more old and are not perfectly flat. They cook fantastic on a ga…

There is one really great use for induction stoves I found. My wife and I have a small one burner induction stove from Ikea, which is basically a high powered hot plate. Its great for putting on the table for hotpot, fondue, shabushabu, korean bbq, etc. Even though I love my gas range, I am always a little weird about putting a propane stove on my dining room table.

Re: New York to ban natural gas, including stoves, in new buildings

#130

Post by Waterluvian »

mcculley wrote: post #126
hedora wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most people around here buy enough battery or generators to keep the power on. PG&E is way below one nine of availability this year, but the outlets inside our house are at 6 nines followed by an eight. Granted, once the propane rationing started, a few of our neighbors lost power for extended periods of time (weeks). The phone company doesn’t maintain internet if the power is out, but there is starlink, and fiber co…

> Most people around here buy enough battery or generators to keep the power on. This is a surprising assertion to me. How can “most people” afford batteries and generators?

Depends on what “here” means. If it means California I’m going to guess 99% of homes don’t have battery backups.
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