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iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

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Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#851

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Usb-c sounds cool for now. But what about when a new port comes out and Apple can’t use it because the EU still mandates to use the old one?

Then industry players would build consensus around a new standard and adopt that into law? Would you prefer a world where browser vendors are all designing their own HTML and JS features independently rather than working off a common spec too? At a certain scale of adoption/societal impact, having a common set of agreed standards is much more important than fragmented "innovation". I would argue having a general and…

Lightning is a better physical connection than USB-C for phones. It's still reversible, but more importantly, it's more durable as there isn't a tongue inside to get broken. Before you reply saying that you've broken a lighting port, read carefully - I'm not claiming they're indestructible, just more resilient to needing to be cleaned out. If you work near metal and dirt or even just missoportune bits of fluff, they'll get stuck inside the port. Solution is to take a paperclip and jam it in and try pulling out the metal shavings or other foreign debris. USB-C's internal tongue is too breakable and in-the-way.

Now, not everybody works in or near a metal shop or a saw mill, but all the people I know with phones wear clothes, which sometimes has lint, especially in pockets where phones are kept, and so aren't totally immune from this problem.

Thankfully there's wireless charging, and it's decently powerful/quick these days, so the whole port can be taped off - when you remember before you go into the workshop, which hopefully is every time.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#852
post #602

Apple being motivated by improving security are BS, and it pains me te see people in this forum falling for it or reapeating this. There is a great tool to increase security: the browser and its sandbox. You don't need to install anything fishy on your phone, and the sandbox rights coukd be sufficient for many apps. But as an example, Apple denies the full screen feature for websites and even PWA... only installed on…

> Apple being motivated by improving security are BS, and it pains me te see people in this forum falling for it or reapeating this. It's the same with privacy. Forcing app publishers to state what user data is being sucked out of their phones was just a poor PR stunt. Nothing has changed. Applications still require payments in form of contact lists (which is more or less illegal in Europe if you don't have permissio…

> which is more or less illegal in Europe if you don't have permission of all people in your address book to share their names and phone numbers

[source needed] as GDPR doesn't apply to private individuals and private databases

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#853
post #673

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think that they care about not having useless apps. They care about the apps looking "integrated" in their system, right? I am an Android user and an Android developer, and I must admit that iOS apps usually look more consistent (in terms of UX). And that's one of the values of Apple: this vertical integration that makes the overall thing look more polished (and probably easier to use to some extent). Of cour…

> After all, why do developers want PWAs? Probably mostly because it is cheaper for them, not because it's better for their users, right? Wrong, PWAs can provide better services for users, and the lack of PWAs and enforcement of the App Store monopoly can hurt them[1]: > The fact that Apple refuses to implement basic features in mobile Safari that Firefox and Chrome have had for years now, and the fact that they refu…

You start by saying that PWAs provide better services than native apps (I don't believe it), and then you go on giving an example where it does not, but where you would like it to do because it would be cheaper?

Seems like you do confirm my points.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#854
post #721

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like a lot of changes, wonder how big the lag between the world and European version will be.

I wouldn't count on Europe being the odd one out here. World vs US is a bigger gap than World vs EU given mmwave and cdma.

It seems like a plausibly deniable way of making sure Europe isn’t rewarded for regulating them though, right?

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#855
post #727

Superior functionality exclusively in the EU — USB-C, side-loading — is a good thing. It will remind US folks that the law is a powerful mechanism for making simple, non-controversial changes that improve everyone’s quality of life; but which corporations would otherwise refuse to accept. BTW — LAAS (lobbying-as-a-service) should probably exist.

But they’re also stuck with physical sims because of those same laws. I vastly prefer the esim in the US iphone to the tray.

eSIMs are totally available here in Germany! Für example https://www.telekom.de/unterwegs/esim

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#856
post #772
post #727

Superior functionality exclusively in the EU — USB-C, side-loading — is a good thing. It will remind US folks that the law is a powerful mechanism for making simple, non-controversial changes that improve everyone’s quality of life; but which corporations would otherwise refuse to accept. BTW — LAAS (lobbying-as-a-service) should probably exist.

Side-loading may bite back in nasty ways. Tiny but locally required apps may use it to work around legit limitations. Pay-for-parking apps, shop loyalty systems etc. Yay for more spyware and api exploiting.

But if it's my choice to take these risks?

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#857
post #724
post #582

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> you can just download the eSIM If we disregard the fact that many older but still usable phones don’t support e-sim (which was the original point), what do you mean ”just” download the e-sim? At least in my country, getting an e-sim is a pretty involved process which requires secure authentication, and specifically in my case that authentication would be gone with the now-broken phone if one didn’t have the foresig…

You literally just reach out to your carrier and they will activate your new eSIM.

No, that is literally not what I do, as I just described.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#858

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a programmer with 22 years of experience, and a member on HN... and even I don't care :)

Why so shallow? Don’t care for this particular feature, maybe but the broader fight is about ownership and control of the things you paid for. Sideloading is going to be nice for programmers as it will have to allow for more flexibility in what apps are allowed to execute

> Why so shallow?

It's called being pragmatic

> will have to allow for more flexibility in what apps are allowed to execute

Of course it won't. There will be 1% of apps that do something that HN crowd will perhaps care about.

The rest will be apps that try to circumvent privacy and security, and/or chase their own goal. Note how much speculation there is about Meta going the side-loading route.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#859
post #776
post #770

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The EU is at the side of the customers as long as the companies making the product are not in the EU. Had the EU a strong phone manufacturer industry that didn't use USB-C, we still wouldn't have that requirement. Companies always maintain closest lobbying ties to the governments they reside in (at least if both economies are equally developed), and countries care less about companies that don't give many jobs to the…

I would like to see some solid proof on this, as I don't buy this claim. The EU has squeezed telcoms on roaming charges which created a lot of howling. The EU also has rather strict regulation concerning gas use of cars, ICE emissions and so on, probably second only to California. The EU approach to food and pharma security is fundamentally different to that of the USA, and it impacts EU companies. Regulations around…

Well.. Germany did lobby very hard to not completely forbid ICE sales by 2035. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-03-05/germany-a...

This was Germany the government, not the car companies. We're not perfect here in the EU either. But indeed the interests do seem more balanced than in the US in general.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#860

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Superior Functionality? That is subjective POV.

Hardly. Apple made their app store incredibly restrictive and took a massive cut of any profits that anyone was making. Not just app sales, any profits. (This happened to hey.com, they wanted a cut of the subscription that users were getting outside of their app). Sometimes apple would just outright steal developer's apps by making their own version, then blocking the original developers by claiming that they were ma…

Am I the only one who loves the way Apple handles subscriptions and the fact that they manage them and make the rules? I don't know a single other store or offering where getting rid of a subscription is easy. Not one. Netflix, Amazon, every newspaper, it's all complete crap. With Apple you have all subscriptions in one place and there's exactly one way to cancel the subscription and it takes five seconds. It's amazing for the customer. It's easily one of my favorite iOS feature.
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