Live data from Hacker News

iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

techradar.com

281–290 of 1001 posts

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#281
post #231
post #110

I bet you a tenner Facebook immediately moves out of EU App Store and will be sideload only, with all privacy related permissions required for the app to run.

And? It will also allow stuff like the smart voting app that apple removed because a dictator told them to.

It won’t, because the smart voting app was not blocked in eu. The markets where these kinda app would be needed are also the ones where sideloading will likely not arrive.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#282
post #143

I think the central question here is: .) whether you buy a phone as a piece of hardware and then own that hardware - which gives you certain rights regarding the usage of that owned hardware or .) whether you are just paying some sort of admission fee to a tightly controlled service, and are basically "lent" a piece of hardware that you have no ownership rights over. All the other stuff about walled gardens, monopoli…

I disagree. While this dichotomy might hold true in other examples, in the case of iPhones it was always possible to push custom software to your own device for development purposes. There is a somewhat arbitrary limitation that those apps only work for a week until the process needs to be repeated (unless you enroll in Apple's Developer Program), but that's a different topic.

The main demand in these "sideloading" discussions is therefore that Apple ought to make installing unlisted Apps easier. Personally, I don't understand why this should be of Apple's concern though. They already present a choice to app developers: Either go through their walled garden or impose a technical process on your (non-technical) end-users. Interestingly, there are already projects like AltStore that try to make the latter easier, which should be taken as proof that the whole "sideloading is impossible" argument is not really truthful.

Why this rose up to the highest ranks of the political system is beyond me.

PS: The existence of Jailbreaks further undermines the argument that you cannot control the software on your device.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#284
post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn’t it a bit like the movies and music? Those who will steal will steal and those who will pay will pay anyway. There are great pirate movie websites where you can watch all the movies at about the same user experience or even better but Netflix etc are doing just fine. Piracy isn’t what it used to be but I do enjoy these sites. The real problem is the subscription fatigue and fragmentation. I won’t subscribe to al…

>Those who will steal will steal and those who will pay will pay anyway. That's not been my experience. Every time a crack appeared for my software sales went down. Every time I strengthened the licensing software sales went up. This is for B2B software, god knows what it is like if you sell to consumers.

Could it be the case that B2B software is more susceptible to piracy induced revenue loss? I imagine B2B being completely utilitarian, thus "free" software would mean direct cost cuts.

In B2C, generally, convenience is the king.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#285
post #253

[flagged]

No. Preventing people from doing something "for their own good" is never the right solution. Instead, we should strive to educate people on proper online safety measures so that they don't fall victim to fraudulent attempts.

> Preventing people from doing something "for their own good" is never the right solution.

Never? So, no laws against speeding, no restrictions of the use of DDT, etc?

I think that, to make electronic devices usable for all, we have to restrict what they can do.

> Instead, we should strive to educate people on proper online safety measures

I would say “in addition”, not “instead”. I think it’s a pipe dream we can educate the majority of the population and keep them educated in these things.

Even if we restrict that to the tech savvy, they too grow old, can have periods in their live where they’re so stressed that it limits their thinking, can get mild dementia, etc.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#286
post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I'm concerned if you 'bought' something, it should be yours to do as you please, including reselling and destroying it. If you didn't buy something, but rented it - for example a game on Steam or Epic Games store - then it should damned say so. It's a straight up lie to say you purchased something if you didn't.

I don't think those alternatives are the right ones. You can sell your iphone without any issue, there are plenty of stores around me offering to buy used models to resell. I'm actually contemplating buying a used model. Can't do that with steam games. I'm also pretty confident that if apple and their services disappeared tomorrow, my iphone would keep on working just like it does today. Sure, no more updates, no mor…

> Therefore, I think the question is whether an iphone is a "general computing device", or "an appliance".

This is a red herring. What matters is your freedom to use, repair, modify, resell, loan etc the hardware you bought and own.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#287
post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. The HN crowd is overcomplicating the issue, and Apple has as much a right as an individual to design their platform as they wish. We like to talk about giving businesses the freedom to build the products that they want and keeping regulators out of the picture and instead letting people vote with their money, yet when people actually vote with their money to buy Apple products precisely for how they are built, w…

I disagree. The mobile OS market is just not open and big enough to vote with my money. I don’t buy iPhones because I like being unable to side load apps. I miss it a lot. The point is that when I make my list of pros and cons of buying Android vs iOS, I still prefer iOS because, as much as I dislike Apple commercial policies and artificial lock-ins, I just loathe Google for what they are. And don’t even call me some…

iOS have a quantity of advantages I’m not willing to lose by going back

What are these?

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most of the cases are found to be on android devices. Do you have some relevant sources about banking fraud? Android devices make up more than 70% of Thailand's market share [0], so it's not a surprise. [0] https://www.statista.com/statistics/814490/market-share-mobi...

Usually the cases show up on social media in our country. The victims post that they’ve been frauded and generally blame it on the banks. The banks then reply and say “the fraud transaction originated from customer’s device”. When you look at the screenshots of victims giving example it’s all Android as far as I can see. Generally after talking to the banks and customers discover that it was their own fault for click…

Can't the banks implement some measures so that only their own apps can do transactions?

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#289
post #273

[flagged]

Most people use web banking , so iOS or not it doesn't matter. Apple just truly believes in security by ignorance.

That was true maybe 10 years ago? Every bank has an app now, even to use normal banking from desktop instead of digital keys everybody is using mobile banking app's 2fa.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#290

[flagged]

[flagged]

I was going to say it feels like apple "alligned" account. Oh no look at all the fraud happening on android, we have to keep iOS fully locked to prevent people from their own stupidity (and protect our own interests, but please don't talk about that).
Post reply on HN