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Hard truths I learned when I got laid off from my SWE job

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Re: Hard truths I learned when I got laid off from my SWE job

#431

Post by mixmastamyk »

remote_phone wrote: post #396
tnel77 wrote: post #368

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a bit to go before I’m a software engineer over fifty, but I have a lot of anxiety about it primarily from an ageism standpoint. I don’t really want to go into management because I love coding and solving problems, but I fear that one day I’ll will struggle to find work due to my age. What has your experience been with this issue?

Over 50 in 2022 is very different than over 50 in 2000. I’m GenX and grew up with the internet but I know life before the internet. I know technology more than most and keep up with it. I play video games (finished elden ring earlier this year) and watch TikTok 2 hours a day. I’m not young but the gap between me and someone younger isn’t a vast canyon like it used to be. My last job hunt a year ago I got over 5 job o…

Well, the issue unfortunately is that we know that but a thirty y-o hiring manager doesn't. A few years back I saw folks commenting on YouTube about the "good old days" of 2013 and had good sensible chuckle.

Also, tiktok is like smoking—wouldn't recommend.

Re: Hard truths I learned when I got laid off from my SWE job

#432

Post by SergeAx »

I was laid off 3 times in my almost 30 years career. Every time it was difficult experiences, but I got some lessons from that.

I still member of two active "ex-..." communities. Those are most helpful and useful, especially when other people are getting there after me and it was a perfect cause to get back in touch, meet for drinks or get back on track with common hobby.

After first one I always open my piggy bank and do the things I wanted for a long time but had no time to do. Like getting a sailboat skipper licence and do a couple of gigs like deckhand on a voyage, repair or long haul. Or travel for a distant destination for a month.

Time between jobs is always great to get in touch with own body and mind, like doing a health checkup or visit short-term psychology group.

And of course it is a perfect time to spend more time with parents, relatives and friends.

Re: Hard truths I learned when I got laid off from my SWE job

#434

Post by Fr3dd1 »

sweezyjeezy wrote: post #411
Fr3dd1 wrote: post #381

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I myself lead a software development team. I am 31 and the last two people I hired were almost 50 and they are very good devs. In my opinion age alone isnt a reason not to hire someone. What is the "common reason" older people are not considered to be hired? I guess because people think they cant adapt or are stuck in some ways in theire thinking. If your future you can show that this is not the case, I guess you are…

Some IC roles do fit more younger candidates than older. E.g. in a startup - often better they not have outside commitments like a family, or need for a healthy work-life balance. Sometimes "work smarter not harder" falls apart and they need to work like a maniac. On balance I've found older colleagues less willing to do that. That isn't meant as a criticism, just an observation about role-fit, those people usually d…

The underlying belief to this is, is that more hours = more results = better results. I highly doubt that this is the truth.

Re: Hard truths I learned when I got laid off from my SWE job

#435

Post by itake »

scarface74 wrote: post #320
anon7725 wrote: post #311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just for context, people in scarface’s type of role can “out-TC” many platform/product engineers of the equivalent level, depending on how rewards are structured. The downside that I’ve noticed is that field roles tend to be cut first in response to market weather/customer focus. But a skilled engineer doing field work is a valued commodity in general.

Yes and No. If I worked for an outside consulting company that would be true - with the inherent risks you stated. Working at AWS in ProServe, our compensation structure is the same as SDEs - 4 year initial offer, large prorated signing bonus, 5/15/40/40 RSU vesting schedule. It’s different for sales. The bright side is that there is always work. Worse case, I can be “hired” by another internal team that needs someon…

I think you’re misrepresenting your story in your original comment. If you want to be an SDE at a Tier 1, you have to leetcode. There is no persuading the interviewer to pass you without testing your leetcode.

If you are comfortable taking a non-SDE role, then there are opportunities at tech companies that don’t require programming skills or leetcode.

I’m happy you have found an alternative career path, but you’re comparing apples and oranges.

Re: Hard truths I learned when I got laid off from my SWE job

#436

Post by [deleted] »

scarface74 wrote: post #412
iLoveOncall wrote: post #383

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't care that you have software engineering experience, you are answering to a thread talking about leetcode interviews by saying you didn't have to leetcode because you took a non-software engineering job. Good for you, but nobody cares.

I didn’t do leetCode in: 2008: when the director of software was looking for someone with a weird combination of VB6, C#, and low level C and C++ 2014: when the new director of software engineering was looking for someone to be on a “tiger team” to go after a new vertical 2016: when the new director of IT was looking for someone who could lead the effort to move from PowerBuilder to C# and JS and to lead the integrat…

[deleted]

Re: Hard truths I learned when I got laid off from my SWE job

#438

Post by pm90 »

lkrubner wrote: post #286

About this: "If you had asked me right after I got laid off how long it would take me to get back to work, I would have said three months – including two months of vacation. It took me a year." That is fascinating. I'm glad they shared this experience. It is very different than my own experience. I'm trying to imagine what that would be like, to go a year looking for a job. Here in New York City, at the end of 2022,…

I found this a bit strange as well. A year seems a bit excessive. The most I've seen is 4 months, with an average of much less than that.

Re: Hard truths I learned when I got laid off from my SWE job

#439

Post by mtc010170 »

w10-1 wrote: post #325
zer00eyz wrote: post #315

I survived the dot com crash (yes I'm old). I have hired (interviewing team member, or hiring manager) hundreds of engineers. If you are hearing "let me know if I can help" (number 5) you might be doing something wrong. You should be hearing some version of " I will talk to my boss" or "I will call for you" or "XXX person I know is looking". I have a list of about 30 people who if they call me I'm going to go out of…

"We brought along the people we thought were the best, who we got along with, who would get the job done" I really appreciate the sentiment. In my experience such networks have been self-serving and mostly exclusionary, rewarding loyalty more than competence. "You need to make some changes" is not particularly helpful when you're outside the fold. What's typically unstated is something about loyalty, esp. not disclos…

> 2. Never give anyone a reason to dislike you

I'm someone who tends to get along and work well with others. That part definitely has its advantages for employability (and life in general), and is recommended. However, taking it to this extreme is just dangerous advice. Constantly being a people pleaser can carry enormous risks, especially (but not limited to) to yourself. It's important to learn to be ok with people disliking you sometimes.

Re: Hard truths I learned when I got laid off from my SWE job

#440

Post by anon50118810 »

doix wrote: post #407
anon50118810 wrote: post #384

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can judge for yourself whether I'm serious or desperate or not. If your standard is 500 applications within a few days, then no. I can't even comprehend that. Are we talking like 10-15 applications per hour? I don't care about the software as such, but so far I'm not desperate enough to provide detailed information about every job I've had since I was a teenager, every reference up front, agree to legal statement…

> Are we talking like 10-15 applications per hour? Pretty much, around 5 minutes per application. >provide detailed information about every job I've had since I was a teenager, every reference up front, agree to legal statements, or whatever else they might insist on, knowing I could be fired later on if I get any of it wrong Either you're completely overthinking it and you can just omit a bunch of stuff, or you're a…

We may be talking past each other. I'm talking about applications for unremarkable positions at large corporations where the application forms are either branded by the company or done through something like iCIMS, Taleo or Workday. You create an account and then you're faced with several steps asking for who knows what. The experience question might be "List all past jobs starting with the most recent" with no date limit. Later on you'll have to agree that you answered everything fully and honestly or you can be fired. Maybe I'm a fool for taking that seriously but the meaning is straightforward to me.

These are also the sorts of positions I think people are talking about when they talk about HR being a barrier, filtering on keywords, or how important it is to network around them before applying. So I don't think it's a matter of the company being stuck with software they can't do anything about, instead the hostile and opaque application process mirrors their actual hiring process, or at least I assume so. I'm happy to hear if you have any insight from the recruiting side at these places.

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