Live data from Hacker News

Google has most of my email because it has all of yours (2014)

mako.cc

131–140 of 400 posts

Re: Google has most of my email because it has all of yours (2014)

#131

The US should use the current market decline to split up Google. Splitting it up would allow for more competition and overall improve the tech sector. Ideally you'd see the government force a split up Youtube, Cloud, Search, and their Ad Exchange into separate companies.

If the US government does this, you can be pretty sure it'll keep taking copies of all email in the split-up Google as well.

As if they arent doing this allready

Re: Google has most of my email because it has all of yours (2014)

#132
From the perspective of yours truly (and probably not anyone else), there is a relatively simple solution to this problem. I have experimented with running SMTP peer-to-peer instead of peer-to--to-peer. While I first did this using L2, before Wiregaurd, Tailscale or Headscale existed,^1 I see no reason it could not be done using today's popular L3 software. One approach is the sender and recipient each run their own SMTP server on an overlay network. Each network might have its own interface, /dev/tap[0-100] being one option. Is this perfect in every way. No. Nothing meets that standard. Does it work reliably. Yes. That is good enough for me. That it works is not surprising since the early internet did not have itermediaries like Google and the early mail RFCs had no conception of third party email providers let alone "webmail", now dominated by "Gmail". Needs of "users" do differ and intermediaries might serve a useful purpose for some, even those who can make a conscious choice. Personally I have no need to be able to email every address on the planet let alone allow them to email me! More practically, I can more easily maintain smaller lists of potential senders and recipients, i.e., "networks", each one a separate network interface. Again, needs will differ based on the user.

Third party email for personal use is like using a PO Box despite have private property, a house, and an address. There is no reason that everyone cannot have their own mailbox on their own property. Even more, instead of the post office managine these PO Boxes, email uses a private entity that is trying to sell advertising services, and/or brokering direct email marketing. Both systems, snail mail and email, have been largely co-opted by the potential for direct mail marketing, so-called "junk mail". Even if one never sees any junk in their inbox (thanks to "filters"), the junk mail senders are still influencing the system. The continued enablement and presence of those junk senders, who are still sending massive quantities of junk with the help of Big Email, is why third party email providers, like Gmail, block residential IP addresses. You own property, a house and an address but you cannot have your won mailbox. That is how third party email provision works.

1. Heck, one could probably use a "lightning" network too but folks today want to use peer-to-peer overlay networks for "crypto" exclusively, not messaging or any other useful activity. Go figure. This whole means of using networks without third party intermediaries is as old as computer networks themselves. Gamers have long used LANs and overlay networks for communication, since before the internet became popular. Arguably, we could think of everything we do on the internet as a "game" that justifies use of overlays.

Re: Google has most of my email because it has all of yours (2014)

#133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like an insane inconvenience. Sorry, what was the point of doing all this again? Just to prove you can?

Nah, just to prove that you can't.

You don't have to drive a car in the suburbs. It just will suck greatly.

Re: Google has most of my email because it has all of yours (2014)

#134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can be against something and still find yourself having to use things you complain about. Folks still eat food even though they are aghast at how farm workers are exploited in the world. You can support robust public transportation yet drive a car due to poor-to-no public transit. Sometimes, facebook is the best place to organize demonstrations against facebook. Just because you have complaints about the world do…

I think the food example doesn't work because it's not optional.

For EFF, communicating with a relevant audience is not optional either.

Re: Google has most of my email because it has all of yours (2014)

#135
post #75
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What email do you use with domain registrar? I ended up switching most if mine domains to google domains simply because i find its ui more convenient for me, all eggs in one basket i guess. But how do you ensure that you aren’t gonna loose access to your domain account?

Given the way Google locks out accounts with no support or appeal I can't think of a worse registrar to use. I use my ISP's email address with my registrar, if they want to keep getting paid each month its in their interests to keep that email address working.

At this point some government entity should provide a way to have an inalienable electronic address. There are strong protections for regular mail, that ensure that mail gets delivered. Cell carriers are required to port numbers. Since email addresses are tied to domain, there should be some usps-like service that allows to have an address, that can be related to a provider of your choosing. And this address is tied to your identity, which you can verify by physically visiting usps or dmv if all else fails.

Re: Google has most of my email because it has all of yours (2014)

#136
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Using your own domain also has advantages in terms of being able to use aliases for different websites so (when, not if) an address gets leaked you can > /dev/null it. If you're cheap like me you can give family members their own subdomain so everyone can have aliases for the cost of a single domain. It's sad to think back on myself nearly two decades ago when Gmail first launched as invitation service and I thought…

Not defending big G here in the slightest but you can do that with Gmail aliases too: Someaddr+alias@gmail resolves to Someaddr@gmail.

OK, but if the point was to obfuscate your "precious" address and use some other "throwaway" address, then this does not work. Your email address can be easily deconstructed and used for spam

Re: Google has most of my email because it has all of yours (2014)

#137
post #26

Having your own email/domain isn’t about privacy. Email has become essentially the key to almost everything in modern life. If I lose access to my email I lose access to basically everything I own and it would be a massive hassle to switch emails. Banks, schools, apps, etc. Often times these services won’t even let you change to a new email if you don’t have access to an existing one. Some use email as 2factor. It’s…

Now think about it, what will I do when Google suddendly decide to ban my email? I don't know, my life is fucked.

Re: Google has most of my email because it has all of yours (2014)

#138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The difference here is that people from the UK voted for losing the right to renew their .eu domains.

Not all of them did. Domains shouldn't be related to citizenship anyway.

How exactly can you have an infrastructural domain decoupled from the nation providing the infrastructure?

Re: Google has most of my email because it has all of yours (2014)

#139
post #26

Having your own email/domain isn’t about privacy. Email has become essentially the key to almost everything in modern life. If I lose access to my email I lose access to basically everything I own and it would be a massive hassle to switch emails. Banks, schools, apps, etc. Often times these services won’t even let you change to a new email if you don’t have access to an existing one. Some use email as 2factor. It’s…

Is it known that domain registrars are better than GMail in this regard? Not asking sarcastically, but I had my domain taken over by registrar(not released to public, just registrar took control of it) after few week of notice when auto renew failed to charge my credit card, and my credit card was working fine elsewhere. Also many registrar like Namecheap cancelled subscription for Russian customers during this invas…

Yep. For the last month, I have been exclusively giving out GMail as "my personal email" instead of .ru, but it was more of an emotional thing. Thinking of it, I genuinely don't know which of these is less reliable in the long run for a Russian citizen: GMail, Russian registrar or a foreign registrar for ..
Post reply on HN