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The non-linear workdays changing the shape of productivity

bbc.com

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Re: The non-linear workdays changing the shape of productivity

#21

Post by [deleted] »

fritolaid wrote: post #13
itslennysfault wrote: post #3

small but important correction... > However, when society industrialised, a rigid, five-day, 40-hour workweek arose in factory settings ummm... no. More like the 6 day 16 hour per day work-week arose in factory settings. The five-day, 40-hour workweek was fought and died for by the labor movement.

in tech, we don't really have 40hr/wk. It's more like 80hr/wk. And work on weekends. If you have a position that requires 40hrs/wk or less and no work on weekends whatsoever, consider yourself lucky. I hear stories about colleagues being overworked on continuous basis.

[deleted]

Re: The non-linear workdays changing the shape of productivity

#22

Post by ojkelly »

fritolaid wrote: post #13
itslennysfault wrote: post #3

small but important correction... > However, when society industrialised, a rigid, five-day, 40-hour workweek arose in factory settings ummm... no. More like the 6 day 16 hour per day work-week arose in factory settings. The five-day, 40-hour workweek was fought and died for by the labor movement.

in tech, we don't really have 40hr/wk. It's more like 80hr/wk. And work on weekends. If you have a position that requires 40hrs/wk or less and no work on weekends whatsoever, consider yourself lucky. I hear stories about colleagues being overworked on continuous basis.

In countries where labor laws are strong working more than 40 hours a week in a salaried role is not common. And when there is overtime, it’s often taken in lieu and expected that you get those hours back out of your regular day.

If you have a position that requires more than 40 hours a week regularly, do the math on your hourly rate, and look at hour its affecting your health. If you’re under 25 you’ll probably get away with it, if not the second order impacts on your life are not insignificant, and can make you less productive.

Re: The non-linear workdays changing the shape of productivity

#23

Post by jacknews »

mkl95 wrote: post #6

Something that the software industry has to assimilate eventually is that unless your organization is very efficient, there's not a big difference between working for 6 or 10 hours a day. Scrum / agile / whatever as understood by most companies does not prevent context switching, synchronous work that could be done asynchronously, and interruptions. When added together, those things shrink your team's capacity massiv…

It's extremely taxing to do more than about 6 hours of real, actual work a day, so any extra hours are almost necessarily spent in less taxing activities like meetings etc.

Re: The non-linear workdays changing the shape of productivity

#24

Post by ojkelly »

jdminhbg wrote: post #8
itslennysfault wrote: post #3

small but important correction... > However, when society industrialised, a rigid, five-day, 40-hour workweek arose in factory settings ummm... no. More like the 6 day 16 hour per day work-week arose in factory settings. The five-day, 40-hour workweek was fought and died for by the labor movement.

Quoted post unavailable.

The 8 hour day [0] did not happen because employers were nice, it was a hard, often bloody, fight in countries all over the world. Spain put it into law in the 16th century, most of the world didn’t get it until the early 20th century.

Increases in productivity probably help, but you could say the same thing about the last 30 years — a time when globally wage growth has been flat for most.

Time again, history shows labor rights are demanded not given, except for the few industries where people are most valuable asset of a company.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eight-hour_day

Re: The non-linear workdays changing the shape of productivity

#25

Post by cercatrova »

fritolaid wrote: post #13
itslennysfault wrote: post #3

small but important correction... > However, when society industrialised, a rigid, five-day, 40-hour workweek arose in factory settings ummm... no. More like the 6 day 16 hour per day work-week arose in factory settings. The five-day, 40-hour workweek was fought and died for by the labor movement.

in tech, we don't really have 40hr/wk. It's more like 80hr/wk. And work on weekends. If you have a position that requires 40hrs/wk or less and no work on weekends whatsoever, consider yourself lucky. I hear stories about colleagues being overworked on continuous basis.

Speak for yourself. The vast majority of engineers I know (in the US and Europe) don't do more than 40 hours a week and without weekends, and oftentimes many work even fewer hours, perhaps even 20 hours a week. There are also so many jobs that if you're truly doing more than 40, that's because you want to or at least haven't bothered to start looking to switch jobs.

Re: The non-linear workdays changing the shape of productivity

#26

Post by Macha »

oakesm9 wrote: post #15
fritolaid wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

in tech, we don't really have 40hr/wk. It's more like 80hr/wk. And work on weekends. If you have a position that requires 40hrs/wk or less and no work on weekends whatsoever, consider yourself lucky. I hear stories about colleagues being overworked on continuous basis.

I assume this is referring to the US? I don’t know anyone who does much over 40 hours in the UK, let alone anything close to 80 hours. A few might pick up urgent tasks on the weekend, but only when needed and not regularly.

I've worked for US companies on their EU offices for nearly 10 years, and there's definitely much less of it here, but I've definitely ran into some US employees who have been less than impressed at how unavailable I am outside hours in that time

Re: The non-linear workdays changing the shape of productivity

#27

Post by throwayyy479087 »

idiotsecant wrote: post #9
jdminhbg wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Productivity gains do not lead to increased worker benefit, they lead to increased owner benefit. Organized labor leads to increased worker benefit.

This is demonstrably untrue - looking at the tech industry for example. Salaries are enormous with no unions.

You shouldn’t state opinions as fact.

Re: The non-linear workdays changing the shape of productivity

#28

Post by jdminhbg »

OkayPhysicist wrote: post #12
jdminhbg wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

If the length of our work week followed productivity, the workweek would be at 13 hours today. Your claim is completely and utterly baseless.

You can easily work 13 hours a week if you are willing to enjoy early 20th century living standards! The gains from productivity are distributed between extra leisure time and extra material benefits.

Re: The non-linear workdays changing the shape of productivity

#29

Post by danielheath »

mattbee wrote: post #14
bingooooo wrote: post #2

A great way to get burned out as work encroaches on every aspect of your life. No thank you.

I work exactly as this article describes, but 25 hours per week. It feels like I am doing the productive 25 hours of a 37 hour work week. I log my hours pretty accurately, which I think makes it a better deal for my employer - no commuting, nothing social, and I'm picking the most productive hours for me. I've also got some freedom to switch between tasks (writing, coding, it's largely only teaching needs me to stick…

My team (4 devs) does this (Some people need structure. It's a terrible arrangement for them.

Some people need training & mentorship. It's a terrible arrangement for them, too.

For experienced staff who are comfortable working with minimal support & direction, it's been the Best Thing Ever.

Not everything suits everyone, and that's okay.

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