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DOE requires plans to promote diversity from grant applicants

science.org

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Re: DOE requires plans to promote diversity from grant applicants

#71

Post by [deleted] »

googlryas wrote: post #52
fny wrote: post #11

This is backwards. We need do this type of investment at the pre-K, elementary, and middle school levels. We need to provide funding to local communities. If all these top tier colleges (I'm looking at squarely my alma mater--Duke--as an example) invested directly in their local communities instead of affirmative action we'd have made far more progress as a nation. Meanwhile, big tech is gentrifying Durham, people of…

Does anyone have a strong rebuttal against DEI issues being a "pipeline problem" in tech? I remember about 5 years ago, Facebook issued a report about its diversity numbers, and it put partial blame on the pipeline problem, saying they basically couldn't hire enough qualified people of certain demographics, and the entire DEI community blew up with how incorrect that was. I specifically remember some ridiculous outra…

[deleted]

Re: DOE requires plans to promote diversity from grant applicants

#72

Post by n0tth3dro1ds »

2muchcoffeeman wrote: post #67
n0tth3dro1ds wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ultimately a job at Apple is the pinnacle for most engineers. You aren’t doing anyone any favors by kicking this racial bias / affirmative action anywhere else down the chain, or onto a different ladder, whether it be in tech, physics, education, research, sports, or whatever. Equal standards for every one. Every adult, child, race, and creed. Every ladder at every rung. Not all outcomes will be equal and any sort of…

How is making sure kids are well educated everywhere "affirmative action"? Surely everyone has the right to a good basic education regardless of where they come from?

> How is making sure kids are well educated everywhere "affirmative action"?

Because the admission programs to the desirable schools at all levels utilize affirmative action to try to reach this end.

Source: went to private schools my entire life. Saw affirmative action at every admission level (1st grade, 6th, 9th, undergrad, and grad school). Have plenty of friends today working in some prestigious jobs/industries who were basically pushed to the next level undeservingly for the final ~6-8 years of their education. And even when they weren’t reaching the next rung undeservingly, they were attending a school that they didn’t have the test scores to get into on pure merit alone. And you better believe they displaced more deserving kids from the area.

>Surely everyone has the right to a good basic education regardless of where they come from?

The poster that I was replying to never made this claim, and I never rebuked it.

Re: DOE requires plans to promote diversity from grant applicants

#73

Post by encryptluks2 »

geofft wrote: post #15
encryptluks2 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe they already address diversity though in their regulations, so I have a feeling this is indicative that they plan implement quotas which is ultimately discriminatory.

I'm not sure I see how that's connected to the article or the linked DOE policy - can you expand on what gets you that feeling? It seems to be saying the precise opposite of that, in my reading.

See Hopwood v. Texas and Fisher v. University of Texas for examples of affirmative action causing schools to deny applicants based on race. Based on the new requirements, it appears to indicate that it will encourage grant applicants to do just that and implement quota-based programs.

Re: DOE requires plans to promote diversity from grant applicants

#74

Post by gruez »

faeriechangling wrote: post #64
kadabra9 wrote: post #43

I can’t think of many better examples of “The Road to Hell is Paved with Good Intentions” than the DEI cult.

I just wish they would stop talking about fighting systemic racism while literally being the greatest institution of systemic racism in the world. I can kind of see where they’re coming from and the benefits they have in some ways, but it’s incredible the same people who enforce racial quotas for a living give condescending seminars on how to be anti-racist. I think there is some social good in equity at any cost jus…

> I just wish they would stop talking about fighting systemic racism while literally being the greatest institution of systemic racism in the world. I can kind of see where they’re coming from and the benefits they have in some ways, but it’s incredible the same people who enforce racial quotas for a living give condescending seminars on how to be anti-racist.

They fixed that inconsistency by redefining racism in terms of power/oppression rather than "discrimination based on skin color".

Re: DOE requires plans to promote diversity from grant applicants

#75

Post by encryptluks2 »

threatofrain wrote: post #59
treeman79 wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nice of you to notice that Trump is not a bigot. Unlike the other side. An ass. Yes. But he did more for lifting up all ethnic groups then any government mandated racism / sexism has ever done.

No, Trump brought a lot of heat on Asians who have no real allies among Democrats or Republicans.

Did he though? I mean, I get that he called COVID-19 the kung fu flu... but that was more directed towards China and suggesting that they were responsible, meaning their government. I guess he could have consistently clarified that it was directed towards the Chinese government, but I don't know if he bears the brunt of responsibility of dumb people that think China meant all Asians and to not be able to understand the distinction between their government and people.

I don't think the Democrats get the same kind of flack from criticizing China without spelling out that they are referring to the government and policies.

Re: DOE requires plans to promote diversity from grant applicants

#76

Post by hotpotamus »

googlryas wrote: post #52
fny wrote: post #11

This is backwards. We need do this type of investment at the pre-K, elementary, and middle school levels. We need to provide funding to local communities. If all these top tier colleges (I'm looking at squarely my alma mater--Duke--as an example) invested directly in their local communities instead of affirmative action we'd have made far more progress as a nation. Meanwhile, big tech is gentrifying Durham, people of…

Does anyone have a strong rebuttal against DEI issues being a "pipeline problem" in tech? I remember about 5 years ago, Facebook issued a report about its diversity numbers, and it put partial blame on the pipeline problem, saying they basically couldn't hire enough qualified people of certain demographics, and the entire DEI community blew up with how incorrect that was. I specifically remember some ridiculous outra…

I mean, what other explanation do you think there is? Isn't the alternative that for one biological reason or another, white men, asians, and jews are winning the meritocracy of tech?

This is actually fairly mainstream elite conservative opinion, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bell_Curve for instance.

Not all that satisfying an answer in my opinion, but I can't entirely discount it. I'd say the jury is still well out though.

Re: DOE requires plans to promote diversity from grant applicants

#77

Post by onos »

fny wrote: post #11

This is backwards. We need do this type of investment at the pre-K, elementary, and middle school levels. We need to provide funding to local communities. If all these top tier colleges (I'm looking at squarely my alma mater--Duke--as an example) invested directly in their local communities instead of affirmative action we'd have made far more progress as a nation. Meanwhile, big tech is gentrifying Durham, people of…

>> Science is science

For me, science is sacred and this initiative is a true sacrilege.

Re: DOE requires plans to promote diversity from grant applicants

#78

Post by miley_cyrus »

For those who aren't in academia, this is every governmental science agency now. For example just 9 minutes ago (midnight ET) a funding announcement from the NIH just hit my inbox for "a mission to serve historically underrepresented populations in biomedical research that award doctorate degrees in the health professions or the sciences related to health."

Re: DOE requires plans to promote diversity from grant applicants

#79

Post by gotoeleven »

There's nothing in the article about what might qualify as a diversity plan besides a vague mention of "We've got a plan to give 5% of the funds to mentoring" people of diverseness.

So are they saying they need to spend some of their grant money on extra tutoring for whatever few black students they manage to find?

Re: DOE requires plans to promote diversity from grant applicants

#80

Post by Velc »

ajross wrote: post #55
throwawaysleep wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I deny that it should matter for grants, hiring, and other career benefits. But it does and while it does, I shall claim I am gay.

That's what you said the first time, and I get the irony. I'm just struck that you're taking such care in your phrasing to clarify to the folks here how you're not actually gay. That doesn't seem to you to cut against your point? You think your identity is important enough not to be ambiguous about it[1], but not important enough to maybe be worth checking to see if people are being fair about it? (Which at the end o…

Snide comment, painful to read. Why should he say something that’s not true just to make people think he’s gay? Your logic is flawed.
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