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On Aging Alone (2021)

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Re: On Aging Alone (2021)

#151

Post by didericis »

Tenoke wrote: post #142
didericis wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How about we not do that and try to actually cultivate real life communities and families through more leadership, planned activities, persistent encouragement, etc. I'm kind of tired of the commodification of anything and everything. Communities aren't just supposed to be these bureaucratically labelled abstract co-locations of people mediated by a billion different services, you're supposed to actually try to get t…

>How about we not do that and try to actually cultivate real life communities and families through more leadership, planned activities, persistent encouragement, etc. How about we don't ignore things that can help actual people and leave them worse off just because in theory there are also nicer sounding solutions.

I'm not sure I'm interpreting you correctly, but if you're claiming what I'm talking about is just theoretical, real life communities have existed throughout the entirety of our species.

That doesn't mean there isn't a place for companion AIs, I just think it's horrible to consider them as anything other than a narcotic. They might work as a replacement for companionship in tragic situations where there are no other options, but there are 7 billion people on the planet. I don't see how it's impractical to encourage people to hang out with each other.

Re: On Aging Alone (2021)

#152

Post by paulsutter »

sbf501 wrote: post #88

I'm in my mid 50's and a number of peers from different circles have all come to the same conclusion: they want to create intentional communities of friends to age with. One couple purchased several acres of land and has two friends living in a tiny house with them. Another friend is trying to raise capital to build the type of apartments/dormitories that the majority of US city-dwellers inhabitied in the late 1880's…

Have you tried it? Perhaps rent a big house together for two weeks. I remember roomates and it wasn’t great

A pedestrian neighborhood in a city can have a real sense of community. You get to know the shopkeepers, restaurants, neighbors. You might try that for contrast. More durable, less risky, hundreds to choose from. You can even invite your friends to move there

Re: On Aging Alone (2021)

#153

Post by dismantlethesun »

frontman1988 wrote: post #122
jazzythom wrote: post #2

feeling this, almost 40. seems like dating is off the menu forevermore but I really never took enough time to enjoy it. Too busy playing with my computers

40 is the prime age for men. You can easily get a younger gf from Thailand/Vietnam/Philippines with minimum effort. And you never know you might find true love (if it exists) as well.

As a disclaimer, I’m very much in favor of international relationships in general but if you are trying to date someone because of economic prowess substituting for physical attraction then you are better suited to doing that in your own country.

Marriage is hard and throwing another culture values and the immigrant experience into the mix can often times make things more difficult.

As relationship advise, i say it’s less stigmatized (no accusations of sex tourism), and easier mentally (no spouse feels like they are the “other” living in a foreign culture) to date someone from a poorer economic background in your own nation. People from small towns have a lot in common with you, no language barriers, no immigration barriers, and should also be seen as a viable option.

Just my two cents…

Re: On Aging Alone (2021)

#154

Post by bigger_inside »

moconnor wrote: post #136
guelo wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're talking about machines that pass the turing test. General intelligence. We're not close yet.

I disagree, humans don’t need another equivalent intelligence in order to feel love and friendship towards it. My favourite tongue-in-cheek example: humans will feel love and kinship toward cats who can’t talk and to all appearances often couldn’t care less about them.

also, role-play RPGs have demonstrated quite well that people fall in love with well-scripted characters with otherwise quite mechanical interaction.

Re: On Aging Alone (2021)

#155

Post by bambax »

jazzythom wrote: post #5
majormajor wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you think dating is off the menu? I know almost-40s that are actively dating. Maybe it's harder in certain areas? I could see this being an advantage of cities...

my tinder has been quiet for years. I’m looking for an attractive mate and I’m 1) not that attractive 2) fat 3) bald(ing) 4) old enough to be the father of those I consider 5) not rich or successful (yet) and worst of all if I got the pretty girl I wouldn't know what to do with her. I don’t want to be that guy. What I want is to go back in time to when I was young. I guess dating just wasn't in my lot. Everyone gets…

This comment is reminiscent of a funny interview Larry David did on Conan:

> My problem is that I was very particular, which is odd because I was very desperate at the time. (...) You'll find that a lot of desperate people are very particular, like even Quasimodo. The hunchback had to have the best looking girl in the village. And then his friends would like and fix him up. They'd go "Quasi, there's a very nice girl in my office, a wonderful personality; I want to introduce you to her." (With a bizarre voice:) "Is she good looking?" "But Quasi! You're a monster! You're a heinous beast! What are you talking about?!" (Same bizarre voice:) "She has to be good looking."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ug02cqP69V4

Re: On Aging Alone (2021)

#156

Post by 9530jh9054ven »

didericis wrote: post #138
9530jh9054ven wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps but I would surmise that the people that would benefit from being in those communities would naturally form irregardless of the distractions of commodified companionship. But that ignores the ones that unwilling or incapable of joining into the communities you describe. Wouldn't this substitution of a human connection be of positive benefit to all involved then?

I don't think companionship can be commodified, and I think any attempt to do so would be the equivalent of an opiate. While there may be specific contexts where it could have utility, I think it's far healthier to encourage those who lack the inclination or willingness to join communities to do so. That's why I mentioned leadership. I think we have a responsibility to give lots of opportunities and encouragement for…

I don't know about actual companionship, but I'd say that one could commercialize the facade of one. Youtube and Twitch's live streaming mechanisms certainly seem to push it; a few dollars to briefly interact and hold the attention of the streamer's attention. At the far end I'd wonder if even prostitution could arguably fit under that idea of commercializing intimacy.

> I think it's far healthier to encourage those who lack the inclination or willingness to join communities to do so. That's why I mentioned leadership. I think we have a responsibility to give lots of opportunities and encouragement for those lacking the initiative or will to socialize, and should try to diminish a lot of the status barriers and animosities preventing such socialization.

It's a noble idea, but begs the question why a community would want to have responsibility to individuals that they may not want to have in their presence in the first place.

... Amusingly it also it just now occurs to me now that what you describe sounds similar religion, specifically to the the Abrahamic faiths and their derivatives.

Re: On Aging Alone (2021)

#157

Post by bambax »

starkd wrote: post #26
rr808 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

4) old enough to be the father of those I consider Yeah this is the real problem. Sure everyone wants to date 20 year old models, but you have to be special to do this. You really would have a lot more than no success with people your own age.

Quoted post unavailable.

> Reminds me of a famous country music song I once heard that goes "pretty girls are nothing but trouble. Date an ugly one".

There's this one:

    Always marry an ugly girl
    That's the only kind
    She'll never ever leave you
    And if she does you won't mind

Re: On Aging Alone (2021)

#158

Post by kareemsabri »

kromem wrote: post #50

AI companionships for the elderly is going to be a beyond massive market by the time we're all old. Sometimes we just need people to listen, and in that AI will exceed most humans, who are generally just waiting for their chance to have someone else listen to them. I'm starting to see the initial beginnings of that market, and already the reviews are eye opening. People gushing over how much of a difference a text-ch…

Do you have any evidence for this claim? Do old people want to talk to robots?

Re: On Aging Alone (2021)

#159

Post by [deleted] »

tasty_freeze wrote: post #101
NalNezumi wrote: post #45

I was expecting some wisdom, at least some insight or sympathy from the article, supposed to be written by 80 year old. All I now feel is pity for her; early in her essay she snobs on "people feeling lonely around loving families" - comparing them to orphans that know true loneliness (and by the tone, she too). Then just a paragraph or two later she reveals she had a family; husband, kids and grandchildren. A couple…

It isn't a how-to article or a flowchart of how to age, it is a rumination on her life and the role solitude and isolate have had in shaping her. While turning over what she thinks about her life, she delves into contradictory positions where both seem true to her; this isn't a flaw, all of us have such notions. I'm not sure how old you are, but as someone approaching retirement age, my thoughts are increasingly turn…

[deleted]

Re: On Aging Alone (2021)

#160

Post by seydor »

sbf501 wrote: post #88

I'm in my mid 50's and a number of peers from different circles have all come to the same conclusion: they want to create intentional communities of friends to age with. One couple purchased several acres of land and has two friends living in a tiny house with them. Another friend is trying to raise capital to build the type of apartments/dormitories that the majority of US city-dwellers inhabitied in the late 1880's…

> to eastern asian cultures and indian subcontinent where multi-generational families mean you're never really alone.

It's high birth rates that create such culture. Europe and US are not comparable , and over time people will get lonelier and lonelier unless they decide to adjust their way of life around this issue and stop living with 20th century standards. Cities should be designed with the single-person in mind now, not the family

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