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Inkscape 1.2 released

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Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#211

Post by dash2 »

sfriedr wrote: post #199
dash2 wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not insane. People want to know whether free software package X is a good alternative to the proprietary version. If it isn't, the fact that it's "good enough on its merits" is irrelevant. If they don't think proprietary software is intrinsically evil, then the free/proprietary distinction is irrelevant to them too. In what way do you find Inkscape to outpace e.g. Figma? That would be interesting to hear.

The free/proprietary distinction is only irrelevant for small-ish projects, on the order of a few months, where "good" is a one-dimensional measure in terms of features the application has: The risk of the software maintaining company being bankrupt in this timespan is low. A typical mid-level employee at a company might be very happy with such tools, especially because they are usually new & shiny too. Now imagine y…

If FOSS is responsible for establishing TeX, then I would pay Bill Gates my last $ to embrace, extend and extinguish the entire miserable movement. TeX is a horror from the 1980s that refuses to die.

Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#212

Post by simonh »

einpoklum wrote: post #187
simonh wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All very good points and I don’t disagree with you. For me the issue is that FOSS is not a good model for generating the massive investment of resources needed to solve many problems. Inkscape is great and if your problem space happens to be adequately addressed by it then fine. It’s not anywhere close to addressing many of the use cases solved by proprietary DTP though and the pace of development is glacial. So I ap…

> If someone wants to charge money for their software, and I think it’s worth it, I’ll pay for it 1. No, you won't. Unless you think almost no software is worth it, or you're a billionaire. And most people don't have the money to be any of the software they would find useful (e.g. an office suite, an operating system). 2. The issue isn't whether you would pay for it or not. The issue - well, the issue for me anyway -…

>1. No, you won't. Unless you think almost no software is worth it, or you're a billionaire.....

I think you'r interpreting what I said as buying all rights to the software outright or something. I'm not quite sure. I meant buy as in pay for the right to use it.

>the issue for me anyway - is whether it is legitimate for the state to police the population to the extent of preventing the sharing of information, including software

It's legitimate for the state to wield the powers delegated to it by the people.

Our society (I mean the west generally but other societies too) have for a very long time decided that ownership rights can be legitimately exercised on some information in some circumstances, for periods of time. I think it's legitimate to extend those protections to software.

I understand you disagree on that, but for me there's both a moral and an economic dimension to the question. Some forms of information should be shareable and in the open, where that is in the public interest, sure. Political speech for example. However where there's a creative or economic value, as with a novel or software, the fact is treating sharing it as a free speech right would be economically catastrophic.

Investment in media production including software development, writing books, creating music, making movies and TV would utterly collapse. I know technically there are theoretically alternate funding models, and even a very few examples of successful projects, but the barriers to entry and risks of such models are in practice so severe that it would still be economically and culturally devastating. That's why you're not going to get public support for such a change.

Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#213

Post by teleforce »

makeitdouble wrote: post #68
teleforce wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really think that the future is Local-First software and FOSS can greatly benefit from the new paradigm [1]. With Local-First software the cloud is just the natural extension for backup and collaboration (real-time or offline) not the sole repository for the data. [1]Local-first software You own your data, in spite of the cloud: https://www.inkandswitch.com/local-first/

The concept looks fine, but was there resistance from users to have local apps talk to cloud resources in the first place ? It looks to me like it’s just describing the situation from a few years ago, but as a pre-packaged concept. I understand the current situation as a result from evolving business models, that lead to better profits when the control is taken away from the user and they have to get into subscriptio…

Coincidentally, currently there are ongoing discussions on how to utilize Git outside of the software engineering field.

In particular, this is small anecdotal case study on how a calendar booking/rental system can work with Git [1]. For me this is a wonderful example of application for Local-First software albeit a simple one.

[1]Ask HN: Why hasn't Git been adopted outside of software engineering?

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31408544

Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#214

Post by prokoudine »

bowsamic wrote: post #208
prokoudine wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think that's how that conversation really went because Martin will be the first person to admit that Inkscape on macOS is problematic. Case in point: https://twitter.com/realdoctormo/status/1514742125132455937

He claimed to me that Mac is not a supported target of Inkscape, and then blocked me

> He claimed to me that Mac is not a supported target of Inkscape

Unless I see a direct quote, I'm likely to suspect that what he actually said was along the lines of "We do not have developers using macOS, so we barely support that platform. Would you like to help us?".

> ...and then blocked me

I don't really know you at all, but I know Martin a little. He can take a punch, so blocking someone means he had serious reasons to be annoyed. OTOH, I'd rather not take sides here, that's between you and him.

Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#215

Post by flobosg »

jillesvangurp wrote: post #200
flobosg wrote: post #2

> Inkscape documents can now hold multiple pages, which are managed by the new Page tool Finally!

I never got the need for pages in a vector graphics tool. Why do vector images need a page? Do people print them? The whole point for me is that the vector image scales. Mostly there is no pre-defined size. So the page dimensions are meaningless. Why would you want multiple of those?

> Why do vector images need a page?

I make slides on Inkscape and until now had to resort to clunky solutions to generate multipage PDF files.

> Do people print them?

Yes. People print PDFs.

> Mostly there is no pre-defined size. So the page dimensions are meaningless.

That’s not true if, for example, you need to render vector graphics on a screen. Since it’s physically impossible to show the entire Cartesian plane, you need to constrain it somehow.

Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#216

Post by digisign »

aliswe wrote: post #138
digisign wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point was, there's no such thing as a free lunch. Someone is paying one way or the other. Comparing a few volunteers to trillion dollar organizations or VC projects is a little silly, is it not? Not to mention "modern design" is often worse in a number of ways. Inkscape is an incredible achievement with the amount of resources it has had available. If you can do better, do so. I'm willing to bet a comparable prog…

There is such a thing as a FOSS lunch, though :) And I think its allowed to discuss the fact that todays lunch seems salty.

If you've got constructive criticism, by all means. Offer only a misunderstood use case, don't expect to be indulged.

Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#217

Post by AtNightWeCode »

Looks great! Glad to see the gradients are more intuitive again. I think the UX can be a bit tighter since it still takes a lot of space on laptops. Less spacing perhaps.

Anyway, I love Inkscape, and it is my go-to software for any vector graphic needs.

Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#218

Post by Tao332 »

foxes wrote: post #97
Tao332 wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> salty I don't think that means what you think it means.

A bit like the meta discussion, salty is current term in society unlike GIMP and Inkscape UI. I have a concrete questions: Why can’t a lot of FOSS projects try and distill what is good about modern UI or ideas instead of looking like a program from 10 years ago. What is the obstruction in the community getting people to work on this? Hostile power user attitudes? Simultaneously if free software advocates want it to b…

Maybe we have different salt. In my regional vernacular, "salty" means something you did or didn't do is making you look like a fool.

This is usually accompanied by someone eagerly pointing out "Don't you feel salty!"

I've seen that use rising among cryptobros lately, specifically to deflect critics as secretly jealous that they missed out on something. I'll allow it as long as they don't co-opt jawn as well.

Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#219

Post by einpoklum »

simonh wrote: post #212
einpoklum wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If someone wants to charge money for their software, and I think it’s worth it, I’ll pay for it 1. No, you won't. Unless you think almost no software is worth it, or you're a billionaire. And most people don't have the money to be any of the software they would find useful (e.g. an office suite, an operating system). 2. The issue isn't whether you would pay for it or not. The issue - well, the issue for me anyway -…

>1. No, you won't. Unless you think almost no software is worth it, or you're a billionaire..... I think you'r interpreting what I said as buying all rights to the software outright or something. I'm not quite sure. I meant buy as in pay for the right to use it. >the issue for me anyway - is whether it is legitimate for the state to police the population to the extent of preventing the sharing of information, includi…

> I meant buy as in pay for the right to use it.

I meant the same thing. You don't have the money for it. Ok, maybe if you mortgaged your house, you might.

> It's legitimate for the state to wield the powers delegated to it by the people.

One can debate what powers have actually been legitimately delegated, if any (also depends on where in the world you live.) I argue people have certainly not delegated the power to government to prevent them from sharing copies of files and running those files.

> Our society (I mean the west generally but other societies too) have for a very long time decided that ownership rights can be legitimately exercised on some information in some circumstances

If you mean that Queen Anne decided to prop up the printers' guild, then yes:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statute_of_Anne

> Investment in ... software development

This argument didn't hold much water before there was a decent infrastructure of free software, and by now it's completely bunk.

> Investment in ... writing books, creating music, making movies and TV would utterly collapse.

Not only would this not collapse, it would barely be impacted, seeing how people copy all of this stuff already - albeit not necessarily legally - and there are public libraries for books.

Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#220

Post by crtasm »

doctormon wrote: post #185
meibo wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But... you want people to use the software you make as a developer, I assume? In the same way that Blender provides an input mode for Maya users, Inkscape could provide input modes for Illustrator users. FOSS is supposed to serve people, if your system can easily accommodate that, I see absolutely no reason not to other than some ideological desire to be different. If someone that has been using Illustrator for years…

There's a keyboard shortcut configuration for Illustrator users. Modifiers too, I hear the difference between ctrl and shift really hurts moving between programs. Not a problem since 1.1

I briefly tested that with 1.1.2, at least r for rotate doesn't do anything.
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