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Inkscape 1.2 released

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Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#91

Post by kevin_thibedeau »

Gigachad wrote: post #86
BeetleB wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amusing you use Gimp as an example, as I've always found its (UI) critiques to be "Not Photoshop" critiques :-)

I have never used photoshop and I still feel unsatisfied with GIMP. I have a long list of thoughts but the simplest one was the fact that moving/rotating/scaling a layer is 3 different tools. I was told a long time ago that there was work to merge them, years later the change comes out and it just groups the tools under one icon so you now have to right click first to select the tool you want. It's pretty much broken…

If anything Gimp is too much like Photoshop. Corel Photo-paint has a much more powerful paradigm of manipulable bitmap objects rather than shoehorning everything into fixed dimension layers. It's unfortunate it never got any respect and withered.

Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#92

Post by hectormalot »

jka wrote: post #21
Gigachad wrote: post #10

Great to see the project moving along, but it's been a persistent feeling of mine that FOSS is starting to get left behind in the dust. The design space has been very rapidly moving towards online, live collaboration tools like Figma, Sketch, Adobe XD, etc and FOSS just has no answer for this market. Even a lot of the big name proprietary tools are finding themselves becoming rapidly obsolete in a world where people…

Have you had a chance to try Penpot ( https://penpot.app/ )?

Wanted to share Penpot as well. It worked surprisingly well for my use case.

Ecosystem is limited unfortunately, eg hard to find someone on fiverr to deliver penpot files instead of figma

Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#93

Post by BeetleB »

Gigachad wrote: post #86
BeetleB wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amusing you use Gimp as an example, as I've always found its (UI) critiques to be "Not Photoshop" critiques :-)

I have never used photoshop and I still feel unsatisfied with GIMP. I have a long list of thoughts but the simplest one was the fact that moving/rotating/scaling a layer is 3 different tools. I was told a long time ago that there was work to merge them, years later the change comes out and it just groups the tools under one icon so you now have to right click first to select the tool you want. It's pretty much broken…

Gimp certainly has its GUI problems - coming back to it after using Darktable has been quite painful. I can accept it has GUI issues. However, for what it does, the only tool that is better is Photoshop. Sure, Lightroom/Darktable has a lot of nifty convenient stuff with a better GUI, but they're simply not a viable replacement for Gimp.

There are other photo editing tools with better UI, but poorer features, sadly. It would take a ton of work to catch up in terms of features.

Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#94

Post by mappu »

audidude wrote: post #22
sydthrowaway wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably because it's single threaded going through multiple slow compatibility APIs.

Sort of, but it's not the whole story. They do use cairo for rendering to a CGContext via cairo_quartz_surface_t which has traditionally not been all that great on macOS. Additionally they're dealing with colorspace transforms on more recent macOS along with some bugs in macOS that were causing non-native applications to do considerable damage/redraws. If/when Inkscape moves to GTK 4, a lot of this will just go away.…

Thanks for your efforts, I'm really pleasantly surprised to hear there is work to improve the GTK 4 experience on non-Linux platforms.

Does this port support the native macOS window decorations, or are they client-drawn?

Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#95

Post by stephen_g »

danielheath wrote: post #90
CharlesW wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If I look at the horrible experience, which is Google docs or MS Office 365, especially their word processing parts, they lack behind soooo much compared to a tool like Libreoffice. You cannot even properly use styles… As a reasonably serious user of Office 365 and someone who's desperately wanted to like LibreOffice, I'm not sure what you could mean by "properly use styles". I'm guessing this is specifically a cri…

LibreOffice is great, but it's not comparable to commercial desktop word processors. However, it's far, far better than any browser-based one I've used.

Depends on what you want to do... I find LibreOffice fine because if I want to create documents that are actually complex I'm going to reach for InDesign or LaTeX. I don't find something like Microsoft Word really much better for anything I'd want to do with it than LibreOffice.

Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#96

Post by cxr »

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #39
Gigachad wrote: post #10

Great to see the project moving along, but it's been a persistent feeling of mine that FOSS is starting to get left behind in the dust. The design space has been very rapidly moving towards online, live collaboration tools like Figma, Sketch, Adobe XD, etc and FOSS just has no answer for this market. Even a lot of the big name proprietary tools are finding themselves becoming rapidly obsolete in a world where people…

Sandstorm.io tries to make collaborative web apps work easily with sharing for non-technical users, though we haven't solved getting people a server easily, or more crucially, convincing people to buy a server to do things they can do for free with ads. Unfortunately, the problem is companies powered by ad revenue have a lot more money to throw at usability than FOSS folks do.

> we haven't solved getting people a server easily

It doesn't help that Sandstorm focuses on apps that are architected with a devops-heavy mindset. Many apps don't really need anything more complicated than PUT and DELETE (no POST special handling required), esp. since they're already doing so much on the client, anyway. This really calls for an auth-protected document store more than it does what Sandstorm tries to provide; the difficulties of "getting people a server" probably starts with assuming/insisting that that's what you need to do in the first place.

Those kinds of architectures are only necessary when you really do need some way to offload computation to a remote, high-availability machine, but things like online image and document editors aren't that. (Even then, what you really want for that is some sort of mobile code architecture that lets you squirt lightweight payloads at some sort of fleet of faceless workers, preferably in the same/similar form to the kind of code that you write for doing useful work on the client...)

Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#97

Post by foxes »

Tao332 wrote: post #80
foxes wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can be salty if you want but the majority of the word has moved on from archaic desktop apps.

> salty I don't think that means what you think it means.

A bit like the meta discussion, salty is current term in society unlike GIMP and Inkscape UI.

I have a concrete questions:

Why can’t a lot of FOSS projects try and distill what is good about modern UI or ideas instead of looking like a program from 10 years ago.

What is the obstruction in the community getting people to work on this? Hostile power user attitudes?

Simultaneously if free software advocates want it to be adopted why don’t they cater a bit to the good things about modern design?

Saltily remarking “you get what you pay for”, is hostile. Fine I’ll use the modern web and tools, and they can lament on HN wondering where everyone went.

Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#98

Post by brudgers »

ihappentobe wrote: post #3

Haven’t downloaded this release yet, but as a longtime user of Inkscape the ability to add and manage pages sounds like an amazing addition to the application. Previously, I would approximate managing multiple pages by hiding and showing layers, then exporting each page manually. Needless to say, I am excited to leave that workflow behind!

Working with layers to simulate pages has been a huge pain in the ass.

I make a zines and print them myself. Often a picture runs across the gutter.

Hopefully this will address two page spreads automatically.

Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#99

Post by dangrossman »

myself248 wrote: post #31
BMc2020 wrote: post #26

I am not ashamed to say I found it too difficult to learn. Sometimes I do colored circles or something else easy at one of the free online sites but I just can't spare the time or mental energy. It's a shame too, I have a laser engraver, SVG is made for that.

Ditto. Every time I try to prep a cut design with Inkscape, I get mired up the distinction (internally) or lack thereof (visually) between lines, paths, objects, strokes, and whatever other internal representations may exist. Some of these things render fine on the display, and cut just fine with the inkcut extension. Some render but do not cut. Some things get cut multiple times, which causes the knife to overpenetr…

> And for years of attempts, I can't seem to understand the distinction, or how to discern what my drawing actually consists of.

If you look at the status bar at the bottom of the window, it always tells you the type(s) of the object(s) you have selected on your screen. So you can quickly tell whether something is a path, or an object, or a text, or whatever. There's also outline mode which hides your stroke and fill styles, so you only see the paths. Paths are what my laser cutter will follow, completely ignoring those stroke widths or fill colors or what have you, so outline view shows exactly what it will cut.

Re: Inkscape 1.2 released

#100

Post by Eduard »

foxes wrote: post #38

Why does it see so hard for FOSS to design a good looking UI. I honestly struggle visually with distinguishing what all those symbols mean. I don't use inkscape enough to memorise keyboard shortcuts. I'm sure an experienced user will come along and proclaim it just works, but as someone who wants to use it intermittently, it needs some serious refinement.

It just works.

Maybe people are just different, but Inkscape's (G)UI has been serving me well enough ever since.

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