Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

reuters.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

231–240 of 373 posts

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#231

Post by bhuber »

jotm wrote: post #204
Mountain_Skies wrote: post #172

Tech companies are making themselves active participants in conflicts involving powerful countries. Sooner or later, one of those countries is going to reach out and strike back in the physical world. It's just a matter of time. When it was little nudges in color revolutions in relatively weak countries, there was not much to worry about. Now? They're playing with fire and the tech folks doesn't seem they have a clue…

I mean, what is the country going to do? At best they can launch a cyber attack (or a lot of them). Any physical action would immediately involve the host country - bombing the Facebook HQ for example could be considered a terrorist act or even a war declaration.

People who get on Putin's bad side have a history of ending up with things like polonium and nerve agents inside their bodies, even when living in western countries. Bombing facebook would likely be further than even Russia is willing to go, but I wouldn't put it past them to poison their head of PR or something.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poisoning_of_Alexander_Litvine...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sergei_Skripal

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#232

Post by jdkee »

HonestOp001 wrote: post #185
trhway wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Tech companies are making themselves active participants in conflicts involving powerful countries. sometimes there are situations when one can't be neutral. A genocidal war like the one Russia is waging in Ukraine is such a situation. >Sooner or later, one of those countries is going to reach out and strike back in the physical world. Like Saudis did. So, it is a personal choice of everybody - whether to live by Ru…

Genocidal war is not what is occurring. It is a land war where Putin wants to gain access to and control significant resources and a warm body of water in the southeast.

Perhaps you should review the relevant standards on "genocide" before commenting.

See https://www.un.org/en/genocideprevention/genocide.shtml

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#233

Post by nindalf »

KerrAvon wrote: post #130
nindalf wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Feel free to suggest different rules. Start with the publicly accessible “Community Standards” and edit it to the point where they are consistent and comprehensive in your book with no special cases. We’ll wait. In reality what you might find is that even some obvious rules like “no naked pictures of obvious minors (<10 years) should be allowed” have exceptions to it. And if you can’t reason why this is true (I’m thi…

I don't necessarily disagree with your larger point, but I don't think the picture you're thinking of is actually worth making a hypothetical exception for, FWIW. The genre of which it is a member is censored regularly on all platforms. Just be consistent and point to the rules and live with the ridicule.

Well you are ok with that picture being censored but many others aren’t. You’re proving my point, it’s impossible to please everyone. Everyone has different standards.

- Fury over Facebook 'Napalm girl' censorship (https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-37318031.amp).

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#234

Post by Dzugaru »

jfengel wrote: post #230
nradov wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There have been many wars around the world since Facebook was founded in 2004. What about these circumstances is different than with other armed conflicts? Why should the principles change?

None of those threatened to become nuclear wars. While nuclear-armed nations have been at war, there was never any real suggestion that nuclear weapons would be used. Also, Facebook has become increasingly conscious over the past half-decade or so of the role that it plays in events. It has already changed its policies to be more activist in preventing the use of its platform for advocating violence. That decision fo…

> None of those threatened to become nuclear wars

How is this even relevant? And do you think fueling hatred is a right call to reduce the probability of nuclear war?

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#235

Post by nradov »

jfengel wrote: post #230
nradov wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There have been many wars around the world since Facebook was founded in 2004. What about these circumstances is different than with other armed conflicts? Why should the principles change?

None of those threatened to become nuclear wars. While nuclear-armed nations have been at war, there was never any real suggestion that nuclear weapons would be used. Also, Facebook has become increasingly conscious over the past half-decade or so of the role that it plays in events. It has already changed its policies to be more activist in preventing the use of its platform for advocating violence. That decision fo…

So are you proposing that a vague statement by one of the combatant countries which could be interpreted as a threat to use nuclear weapons in some hypothetical future scenario should be the policy dividing line for Facebook? Back in 2018 the US government suggested that we might use nuclear weapons to retaliate against a serious cyber attack. So by that standard we've been under threat of nuclear war for some time now.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/16/us/politics/pentagon-nucl...

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#236

Post by apologiesalso »

hervature wrote: post #181
nindalf wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the most absurd take. So they should stand their ground against the Russian advance, but inflict no harm to the Russian soldiers? You’re welcome to try it, but please forgive the Ukrainians if they take the common sense route. By the way, there’s a reason we admire Tank Man, but we don’t know his identity.

In case you are unaware, stand-your-ground is a term that allows for deadly force to repel an attacker instead of mandating retreat if it is an option. [1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stand-your-ground_law

I think most people are okay with that, especially in the west, but I'd say all over the world. But in the west you have strong values of fighting for your freedom, arming yourself, having the right to be armed and to fight for your freedoms and that death is better than surrendering your freedoms.

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#237

Post by trhway »

boringg wrote: post #229
trhway wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>All this talk of genocide and nazism in Ukraine is devaluing the meaning of those words. I think what is extremely devaluing and disrespectful of the past anti-nazi fighters and genocide victims is to allow Nazism and genocide on our watch. > is grossly inaccurate verging on absolute ignorance or troll. whole country of Ukraine are ignorant trolls? In Ukraine they normally call it a Russian fascism - "russism" ['ras…

Nazism: Nazism is a form of fascism, with disdain for liberal democracy and the parliamentary system. It incorporates fervent antisemitism, anti-communism, scientific racism, and the use of eugenics into its creed. —- Where is the antisemitism, anti-communism, or eugenics - i don't see any of that which are CORE to nazism? Im sorry this situation is terrible in Ukraine but it is not genocide or nazism.

Only open antisemitism seems to be missing currently (though i'm not a Jew and can't really comment how being a Jew may feel these days in Russia) even though "global Zionism" as an enemy is present as undercurrent in the Great Russia myth, the anti-communism is definitely there, and racism and eugenics is a bit in the background and not declared clearly under those names (as the names carry baggage).

Those specifics aren't core to nazism. The principles behind those are core. I.e. instead of antisemitism there may be hate to some other ethnicity for example.

I.e. from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazism

"Nazism is a form of fascism,[2][3][4][5] with disdain for liberal democracy and the parliamentary system. It incorporates fervent antisemitism, anti-communism, scientific racism, and the use of eugenics into its creed. "

That "disdain" is 110%, a core thing of the current Russian Fascism and you can just s/German/Russia/g below (from the same https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazism )

"Its extreme nationalism originated in pan-Germanism and the ethno-nationalist neopagan Völkisch movement which had been a prominent aspect of German nationalism since the late 19th century"

There is also motif of WWI defeat which in modern Russia is USSR collapse as a defeat in Cold War.

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#238

Post by therealjumbo »

lazide wrote: post #163
therealjumbo wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Biased and manipulated news is a spectrum like security. You can find instances of anything in the past of you look hard enough. We are currently in a time of more bias and manipulation than the 60s/70s. Additionally, pointing out that Facebook lacks any fundamental principles and is just a reed in the wind is a great observation.

Not even close - look up COINTELPRO and how many of the letters that were sent by the discoverers of that information ACTUALLY made it, let alone how few that did make it actually got published. Hint : very few. The media has always had to kowtow to some degree to local authority, and there is always the element of ‘the truth we choose to believe’ (or are being told to believe) being published over harder reality. Th…

COINTELPRO was a thing, yes, but now almost all news is manipulated. Then stuff related to those stories was, big difference.

>The media has always had to kowtow to some degree to local authority,

Yes, that's what I mean, to what degree? That degree is much greater now than it was in the past, except the one doing the manipulation isn't necessarily the government.

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#239

Post by nindalf »

hervature wrote: post #181
nindalf wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the most absurd take. So they should stand their ground against the Russian advance, but inflict no harm to the Russian soldiers? You’re welcome to try it, but please forgive the Ukrainians if they take the common sense route. By the way, there’s a reason we admire Tank Man, but we don’t know his identity.

In case you are unaware, stand-your-ground is a term that allows for deadly force to repel an attacker instead of mandating retreat if it is an option. [1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stand-your-ground_law

I’m aware of it. But in the context of war, it’s splitting hairs.

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#240

Post by hiram112 »

lalaland1125 wrote: post #94
pyronik19 wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here you are perpetuating more western propaganda and potential misinformation. First of all the difference between a "biolab" and a "bioweapons lab" is a semantic difference without actual substance. If covid was released out of the wuhan lab, the now predominate theory, this wasn't a "bioweapons lab" but just a "biolab". What is the practical difference? Fact is, anyone performing research that could be used as a b…

Do you have any evidence that the biolabs in Ukraine were performing research that was oriented towards being usable as a weapon? Like what exactly is the claim here about that those labs were doing? Or do you just think any biolab should automatically be assumed to be working on bioweapons? (And that we should ban all biolabs worldwide I guess?)

The line coming out of the US gov't no longer even makes sense, IMO.

They've claimed, like you, that the labs were just general biolabs you'd find at any university, and anything related to WMD is just Russian "disinformation."

But they've also claimed that these labs were old Soviet-era weapons research labs the DOD was helping to close down.

So which is it?

If they're closing down old weapons labs, why'd it take 17 years? If they're not weapons labs, why are they so afraid (as Nuland from State Dep't claimed) of the Russians seizing or destroying them?

If they're just research labs for the good of humanity, the gov't needs to explain to us taxpayers why they continue building up infrastructure and subsidizing research and jobs in foreign countries with money borrowed from China and / or printed up, which is now exacerbating inflation. How many underemployed PHDs in the US could be doing some research here at home with the hundreds of millions of dollars we've just handed out to Ukraine?

Post reply on HN