Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

news.ycombinator.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

661–670 of 1001 posts

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#661

Post by krageon »

teekert wrote: post #180

This whole situation is so surreal and disappointing. I grew up on Star Trek and somehow I just though we had (almost) arrived in a post-war, federation-like world. We know things should be solved with words because otherwise there are only losers. It’s how we raise our kids. I just keep thinking about how Jean Luc is looking down on us from orbit, slowly shaking his head whispering “Savages.”

> I grew up on Star Trek and somehow I just though we had (almost) arrived in a post-war, federation-like world.

The Star Trek universe explicitly had a third world war, which was absolutely devastating. In that sense we're doing really well!

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#662

Post by roca »

lamp987 wrote: post #405
iamshs wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ukraine is being invaded and will come under occupation. Ukrainians are being killed. There is no way Russian propaganda would have held any sway.

And yet when US military killed hundred thousand Iraqi civilians, much fewer people cared... Propaganda works and CAN justify aggression in eyes of the people.

The US military killed nowhere near that many. It was mostly internecine warfare.

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#663

Post by mcdonje »

teekert wrote: post #180

This whole situation is so surreal and disappointing. I grew up on Star Trek and somehow I just though we had (almost) arrived in a post-war, federation-like world. We know things should be solved with words because otherwise there are only losers. It’s how we raise our kids. I just keep thinking about how Jean Luc is looking down on us from orbit, slowly shaking his head whispering “Savages.”

Star Trek is a communist utopia. Our world won't resemble it as long as their are people who have the means and motivation to circumvent democracy. Unfortunately, such people exist in every major power.

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#664

Post by hugojaba »

eftychis wrote: post #571
dukoid wrote: post #461

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many people also did not care about Georgia. So while cultural proximity is certainly a factor, geographical proximity seems to be a significant factor, too. I don't think Sreberenica is forgotten or was ignored in Europe. The West seems to be slow to wake up -- and Putin got high on his sequence of "successful" wars. I don't want to deny that hypocrisy exists here, but it doesn't justify Putins crimes anywhere.

Georgia and Ukraine are tightly connected in this through the same precursor events. The "West" is simply deaf. Multiple analysts had brought these concerns since before Crimea. (Disclaimer I am from the West -- trying to be objective here and focusing on the non-NATO side.) The diplomatic relationships since Russia Federation's birth have been problematic and idiosyncratic. Russian people wanted recognition of their…

What values would those be? I'm really not following you?

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#665

Post by lm28469 »

sdevonoes wrote: post #587
koonsolo wrote: post #511

I have a different message: Go on the street and take control of your country, before you turn into another North Korea. Ukrainians were able to overthrow their government, and so can you.

> Go on the street and take control of your country, before you turn into another North Korea. So, you are saying that one should risk their life for their country? No, thank you. I never understood this kind of "patriotism".

> for their country

I had a discussion about that a few days ago with friends. It's not necessarily "for your country" or "patriotism" it can just be fighting for what you stand for.

Sadly what a lot of people stand for these days is living their little comfortable life, as long as war doesn't knock on their door they're fine, but then when it does happen it's too late

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#666

Post by screenbreakout »

rob74 wrote: post #601
squarefoot wrote: post #302

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chechnya war also was very close and nobody cared since they were mostly Islamic, and the war in the former Yugoslavia happened just in the middle of Europe, but apparently many have already lost memory of it despite the atrocities committed. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srebrenica_massacre

The difference is that Russia invading Ukraine is a clear-cut war between two independent states. Chechnya was/is a part of Russia, so the situation is the same as in China with Xinjiang and Tibet. And Yugoslavia was a complicated and bloody break-up of a federal republic (followed by the even more complicated and bloody break-up of Bosnia and the breaking away of Kosovo from Serbia). But the Russia-Ukraine war bring…

I beg to differ, all people have a right to self determination...ideally on a local (village) level. I'd actually like people to question the meaning on countries and what they project with the never ending question of "where are you from" I come from a mixed background and look forward to where I'm going (which is much more interesting ) Countries imo are a colonialistic power grab by political elites who want to fill their pockets and freeload on the questionable idea of cultural identity (Slovakia...etc) not that it doesn't exist but it's often a bit racist or very local... Anyway afaik Tibet was invaded...

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#667

Post by fransje26 »

necovek wrote: post #423
Cthulhu_ wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"We" tried talking, "we" didn't do the warmongering, where is that coming from? Granted, the US did a lot of warmongering in the middle east; I get that they wanted to retaliate after 9/11, but instead of rooting out the ones responsible directly they made up a motive (WOMD in Iraq) and did a full scale invasion there; I'm not saying Iraq was a pleasant, peaceful country or that Hussein was a nice guy, but the US inv…

European countries were pretty heavily involved in the NATO bombing of Serbia. You can debate the justification, but it's certainly not "live and let live".

Absolutely right. Bombs and all, NATO baaad. On the flip side, I'll leave this here, to bring back a bit of perspective. Especially on the "let live" part: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srebrenica_massacre

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#668

Post by koonsolo »

encryptluks2 wrote: post #644
koonsolo wrote: post #511

I have a different message: Go on the street and take control of your country, before you turn into another North Korea. Ukrainians were able to overthrow their government, and so can you.

Quoted post unavailable.

US is a democracy. Go vote for the leader you want.

Russia is a dictatorship, Belarus is a dictatorship. If you cannot vote with a pen, you'll have to vote with your collective power.

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#669

Post by ignoramous »

Zvez wrote: post #621
sakopov wrote: post #472

The reason Russia has elevated tyrants to power for centuries is deep-rooted in Russian soul to the point where it's not even a problem. It's something that is inexplicably difficult to understand unless you actually experience the culture for a good portion of your life. There is a lot of literature out there about the "Russian Soul" and I really recommend reading it to understand how this happens. In my opinion it'…

(disclaimer, I'm russian but not Russia citizen, but I 'experienced the culture' for 30 years) This is wrong. There is not so much special russian 'mentality' left in Russia, not in the big cities. People there have more-or-less the same 'european values'. The problem now is that we used to think of ourselves as 'good guys'. We destroyed nazis and even though we did a lot of not so good stuff, in minds of russians it…

The constant rhetoric reducing Russia to just Putin (mad-man), or Communists (not-democratic), or worse, a generic Russian soul (not-european) is Western political bias at play. It is trivial to dehumanize, devalue, derogate an entire nation once you have made these labels stick. After that, garnering consensus for inflicting sanctions, suffering, segregation becomes a walk in the park.

Both sides of the table are guilty of doing this, but the West is way more influential and hence much effective at propaganda.

Playbook as old as humans themselves: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten_stages_of_genocide#Ten_sta...

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#670

Post by throw_a_grenade »

thinkindie wrote: post #451
Cthulhu_ wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I heard Russia violated a treaty that prohibited any acts of war for a month or so after the end of the special olympics with this. I don't know the consequences to that, but it's probably trivial compared to international sanctions.

Russia is targeting cities and civil targets, employing bombs that have been banned (cluster bombs), and committing war crimes, I don't think they currently give a damn about the Olympic Truce.

Just to correct a minor mistake: cluster bombs are not "banned", there's a treaty signed by some countries which prohibits them, but many countries are not part of that treaty, incl. Russia, Ukraine, Poland and USA for that matter.

But you're right that their use against cities full of civilians is wrong, very likely a war crime.

Post reply on HN