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Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

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Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#211

Post by freewinz »

verall wrote: post #207

Soybean oil has less partially hydrogenated oils than other deodorized oils, making it potentially the healthiest of the deodorized oils. Obviously deodorized oils are not very healthy, but I honestly don't understand all the posts like "Eat only coconut oil/butter/lard". For the "appeal to science", there's plenty of data that diets very high in saturated fats is a risk factor for heart disease. For the "appeal to n…

This comment comes off as extremely uninformed; there is far more chemistry involved in nutrition than the tiny factors you mentioned.

Appealing to science could also be eating a higher saturated fat diet like in France where heart disease is lower than in the US.

There is lots of science that is ignored by the ignorant and uninformed.

Not to mention omega6 vs omega3; what you say is "appeal to nature" is actually appealing to science for some chemistry

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#212

Post by jesterpm »

telchior wrote: post #184
jesterpm wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My personal philosophy is that nothing is good in excess. Avoiding soy products is hard since soybean oil seems to be the oil of choice for anything pre-made. So I basically avoid soy in most everything I prepare myself (and try to prepare most things myself). When I'm cooking/baking, I use butter, olive oil, and (lately) bacon grease, depending on what I'm making. Coincidentally, in January I had made a list of ever…

Tortillas should be pretty easy to make at home too, although I've had a tough time finding a press that doesn't break.

They are really easy. I have a tortilla press, but I don't like it (the tortillas weren't thin enough). I've just been rolling them out with a small rolling pin.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#213

Post by adrian_b »

cheald wrote: post #165
telchior wrote: post #44

Taking account that this is unproven in humans -- it's enough for me to avoid soybean oil, as cooking oil choice is not very important for my palate. That said, which oils would you use for frying and baking? Most high smoke point oils are, like soybean, polyunsaturated, so I'd guess that they could have some of the same (proposed) negative effects. Bonus points if the alternative is widely available (I see potential…

Avocado oil is fantastic for high-temperature cooking (smoke point ~500F). "Pure" or "refined" olive oil has a smoke point of around 410F; it's EVOO that has the lower smoke point. Deep frying happens at ~375F. Coconut and MCT oils are great for baking, but they do have lower smoke points (320-350F) so they're inappropriate for frying. I generally prefer cooking, frying, and baking with avocado oil, both because of i…

I am sure that avocado oil is excellent for high-temperature cooking and I assume that in USA it is cheap, so it is a good choice.

However the price of avocado oil varies wildly from country to country. In Europe, where I live, it is 3 to 6 times more expensive that olive oil and 15 to 20 times more expensive than high oleic sunflower oil.

So in most places of Europe, the best choice for high-temperature cooking would be high oleic sunflower oil, because it is very cheap, being produced locally and not imported, like avocado oil.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#214

Post by andreilys »

sydbarrett74 wrote: post #135
andreilys wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes afaik, although I’ve heard some ppl say that coconut oil has too much saturated fat making it not great for you. Avocado oil seems to be the best?

My research shows that coconut oil's benefits are chiefly as a topical treatment. As far as ingesting it, the benefits are minimal to nonexistent, and better derived from other sources.

Yea I guess the chief benefit of using coconut oil is you’re not ingesting seed oils which seem to be quite harmful.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#215

Post by Pxtl »

rob74 wrote: post #55

Interestingly enough, soybean oil is virtually non-existent over here in Germany - at least not as oil that you can buy (here the dominant ones are canola, good ol' sunflower and olive - the latter not for frying though), and I also haven't heard of it as an ingredient in industrial foods, but I wouldn't vouch for that.

I don't think you'll see "soybean oil" as a product on a shelf you'll see in any grocery store anywhere in the world.

It's an ingredient in pre-made foods.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#216

Post by unfocussed_mike »

ryeights wrote: post #206
unfocussed_mike wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Economics, probably -- sunflowers and canola grow more easily. Olive oil is a nice pan-frying oil, it's what I use. Linguistic thing: When Americans talk about oil for frying, in my experience, they are a fair bit more likely than us to specifically mean deep frying, for which olive oil is no use. Way more of a deep-frying culture, from several different influences. American cooks are slightly more likely (than the B…

“Broiling” would refer to using the broiler on one’s oven, I’ve never heard that term used to describe pan-frying. Terms I have heard are sautéed and seared

The main difference is the direction of the heat though. Top down rather than stove top. More or less the same deal otherwise.

"Seared" and "sautéed" we do use! It's just we also use "frying" for that, and "frying pan".

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#217

Post by dnissley »

zymhan wrote: post #16
jacobmischka wrote: post #8

What is soybean oil traditionally called in the US? I've never actually seen "soybean oil" myself (though it surely exists). Is this the same as "vegetable oil"?

It is indeed frequently sold as "Vegetable Oil", which is a generic term. However, if you read the Ingredients, you'll find that most Vegetable oils are composed of mostly, or pure, Soybean Oil.

Example: https://www.walmart.com/ip/Great-Value-Vegetable-Oil-1-gal/1...

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#218

Post by somenameforme »

softwarebeware wrote: post #29
simonsarris wrote: post #4

> The same UC Riverside research team found in 2015 that soybean oil induces obesity, diabetes, insulin resistance, and fatty liver in mice. Then in a 2017 study, the same group learned that if soybean oil is engineered to be low in linoleic acid, it induces less obesity and insulin resistance. > “The hypothalamus regulates body weight via your metabolism, maintains body temperature, is critical for reproduction and…

It's interesting to try and square the multiple conflicting findings about the effect of the modern diet on the brain and other observed phenomena such as The Flynn Effect ( https://ourworldindata.org/intelligence ) that mean IQ is increasing over time.

The Flynn effect has been observed to have reversed in a number of nations in Scandinavia and elsewhere. [1] Scandinavia is the typical test bed because of have compulsory military enlistment paired with IQ testing. And the declines are quite substantial with Norway seeing a 5 point decline between individuals born in 1991 compared to those born in 1975, and a 3 point decline compared to those born in 1962.

Big meta studies may miss this because its a relatively new trend, and IQ is full of a million biases that can just generate noise when combined. When people are young, their IQ is significantly influenced by environmental factors, but as they age genetic factors become dominant. And in countries without some form of compulsory testing, sample biases abounds.

As for the past gains, look at height! Height is reasonable proxy for nutrition and globally it's just skyrocketed [2]. Japan is one of the more extreme examples, with their average height increasing by about half a foot since 1896!

[1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flynn_effect#Possible_end_of_p...

[2] - https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/average-height-of-men?tab...

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#219

Post by krrrh »

telchior wrote: post #44

Taking account that this is unproven in humans -- it's enough for me to avoid soybean oil, as cooking oil choice is not very important for my palate. That said, which oils would you use for frying and baking? Most high smoke point oils are, like soybean, polyunsaturated, so I'd guess that they could have some of the same (proposed) negative effects. Bonus points if the alternative is widely available (I see potential…

One pet theory that I've been harbouring for a while is that the different obesity rates in the US and Canada could be party explained by the dominance of canola vs soy/corn oil in various prepared products. Many brands of mayonnaise or potato chips will use canola oil in the Canadian version and soybean oil in the US version. A sensitive palate can taste the difference in the same way that Mexican coke made with cane sugar is distinguishable from the US HFCS version.

Contrary to what many people think canola's omega-3 to omega-6 ratio is actually not too bad, while soy and corn are off the charts in terms of omega-6 dominance.

EDIT: to answer your question on cooking or baking, coconut and avocado are great, mostly monounsaturated, and have high smoke points. As does pure olive oil (the yellow stuff, not the green EVOO, which is preferred for salad dressings or lower heat cooking). There was a recent study, done at UC Davis, that found a lot of avocado oil to be fraudulent.[0]. Otherwise for frying, beef tallow is still the best, and ghee can also be used for sautéing since it has a much higher smoke point than unrefined butter.

[0] https://www.ucdavis.edu/food/news/study-finds-82-percent-avo...

> Only two brands produced samples that were pure and nonoxidized. Those were Chosen Foods and Marianne’s Avocado Oil, both refined avocado oils made in Mexico. Among the virgin grades, CalPure produced in California was pure and fresher than the other samples in the same grade.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#220

Post by jelliclesfarm »

jelliclesfarm wrote: post #162

The three oils/fat I have been taught to use in my Indian kitchen are: sesame seed oil, ghee and coconut oil. Sesame seed oil because it has a high smoke point. Ditto with ghee. The choice of oils always has to do with smoke point and hence what we use it for in the kitchen. [..] Sesame oil is full of antioxidants. Along with vitamin E and phytosterols, it contains lignans, sesamol, and sesaminol. These compounds hel…

Wow. Read one article from the web and everything else is ‘BS’.

I mentioned that this is for an Indian kitchen. Specifically. Our cooking involves tadka(tempering) and sautéing..we use more pulses/lentils and one pot vegetable preparations than meat..meat requires high heat for Maillard reactions.

High smoke point is not to just guide for deep frying in Indian kitchens. We don’t use oil just for deep frying. Everything I learnt is by sound rather than sight with high heat. With the spices we use, aroma and flavour is an integral part of the cuisine. When we temper mustard seeds, we have to ‘listen’ to the sputtering. With ghee, we have to ‘listen’ to the sound of milk solids caramelising. Higher heat will destroy the food.

Good quality olive oil at any heating point is wasted. Refined olive oil at high smoking point is more trouble than food. Considering I have an actual degree in cooking..of international standard for many kinds of cuisines ..…plus multi generational/multi regional Indian cuisine by experience, I think that I can safely ignore any calls for BS about my food and cooking on Hacker News. Stick to your lane.

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