Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

universityofcalifornia.edu

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

171–180 of 464 posts

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#171

Post by jesterpm »

telchior wrote: post #44

Taking account that this is unproven in humans -- it's enough for me to avoid soybean oil, as cooking oil choice is not very important for my palate. That said, which oils would you use for frying and baking? Most high smoke point oils are, like soybean, polyunsaturated, so I'd guess that they could have some of the same (proposed) negative effects. Bonus points if the alternative is widely available (I see potential…

My personal philosophy is that nothing is good in excess. Avoiding soy products is hard since soybean oil seems to be the oil of choice for anything pre-made. So I basically avoid soy in most everything I prepare myself (and try to prepare most things myself).

When I'm cooking/baking, I use butter, olive oil, and (lately) bacon grease, depending on what I'm making.

Coincidentally, in January I had made a list of everything in my fridge and pantry. The only things left with soy were mayonnaise, tortillas, and hamburger buns. I started making the bread products myself for fun. I haven't tried to replace the mayonnaise yet (I really dislike avocado mayo), but it's next.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#172

Post by jazzyjackson »

jacobmischka wrote: post #8

What is soybean oil traditionally called in the US? I've never actually seen "soybean oil" myself (though it surely exists). Is this the same as "vegetable oil"?

Another one that annoys me is "wildflower honey" is actually honey from pollinating fields of soybeans.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#173

Post by telchior »

cheald wrote: post #165
telchior wrote: post #44

Taking account that this is unproven in humans -- it's enough for me to avoid soybean oil, as cooking oil choice is not very important for my palate. That said, which oils would you use for frying and baking? Most high smoke point oils are, like soybean, polyunsaturated, so I'd guess that they could have some of the same (proposed) negative effects. Bonus points if the alternative is widely available (I see potential…

Avocado oil is fantastic for high-temperature cooking (smoke point ~500F). "Pure" or "refined" olive oil has a smoke point of around 410F; it's EVOO that has the lower smoke point. Deep frying happens at ~375F. Coconut and MCT oils are great for baking, but they do have lower smoke points (320-350F) so they're inappropriate for frying. I generally prefer cooking, frying, and baking with avocado oil, both because of i…

Oh, I didn't know there's a variant of olive with higher smoke point. I'll look out for that, thanks! Not sure if I'll be able to find avocado but I'll try.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#174

Post by znpy »

jelliclesfarm wrote: post #162

The three oils/fat I have been taught to use in my Indian kitchen are: sesame seed oil, ghee and coconut oil. Sesame seed oil because it has a high smoke point. Ditto with ghee. The choice of oils always has to do with smoke point and hence what we use it for in the kitchen. [..] Sesame oil is full of antioxidants. Along with vitamin E and phytosterols, it contains lignans, sesamol, and sesaminol. These compounds hel…

> It’s actually harmful to use it for frying etc.

Claims like this are BS.

South italian here. People from south italy have traditionally produced and used olive oil pretty much exclusively and for pretty much everything. Frying stuff is a huge part of the tradition. No relevant problem ever found regarding that. On the contrary: the mediterranean diet is a well known healthy diet.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#175

Post by unfocussed_mike »

Pyramus wrote: post #138
rob74 wrote: post #55

Interestingly enough, soybean oil is virtually non-existent over here in Germany - at least not as oil that you can buy (here the dominant ones are canola, good ol' sunflower and olive - the latter not for frying though), and I also haven't heard of it as an ingredient in industrial foods, but I wouldn't vouch for that.

It's a very German thing to not use olive oil for frying. It took me by surprise when living abroad, and to realise it's a common frying oil in Mediterranean countries but also in the UK.

Economics, probably -- sunflowers and canola grow more easily.

Olive oil is a nice pan-frying oil, it's what I use.

Linguistic thing:

When Americans talk about oil for frying, in my experience, they are a fair bit more likely than us to specifically mean deep frying, for which olive oil is no use. Way more of a deep-frying culture, from several different influences.

American cooks are slightly more likely (than the Brits at least) to use the term "broiling" for shallow/pan-frying. Unusual word here.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#176

Post by undersuit »

SquareWheel wrote: post #104
09bjb wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Canola is a branding name to distract you from the fact that the oil is technically from the nearly un-marketable "rapeseed".

Canola is a genetic evolution of rapeseed. They are not the same thing.

Meh, it's all just Rapeseed. No one considers Granny Smith apples to be a different species from Red Delicious cultivars.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#177

Post by rvense »

crowbahr wrote: post #146
pigeonhole123 wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. We have common genes going back to mammals who did experience torpor. 2. A study doesn't "own" their data and have exclusive right to interpret this data 3. Someone selling something that they think is beneficial to their customer, does not mean it is not beneficial. I would say most people who sell things honestly think their customers will benefit from their product.

> We have common genes going back to mammals who did experience torpor. We also have genes that are related to cows, have you tried subsisting on grass? Your argument is farcical and entirely based on the preaching of a snake oil salesman, in a comments section based on a torpid male mouse study that specifically refutes the argument you're making.

Um, don't we have something like 30% of our DNA in common with actual grass, nevermind grass eaters?

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#178

Post by olva22 »

telchior wrote: post #44

Taking account that this is unproven in humans -- it's enough for me to avoid soybean oil, as cooking oil choice is not very important for my palate. That said, which oils would you use for frying and baking? Most high smoke point oils are, like soybean, polyunsaturated, so I'd guess that they could have some of the same (proposed) negative effects. Bonus points if the alternative is widely available (I see potential…

I would second Avocado oil for high heat cooking, high in MUFAs. Also good for uses where you want a tasteless oil like mayo if you don't enjoy the taste of extra virgin olive oil.

Extra virgin Olive for low heat application.

Definitely want to avoid Cottonseed as it contains a chemical used as male contraception (unless you want that!)

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#179

Post by hammock »

exhilaration wrote: post #143
______-_-______ wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Has anyone done the research to find a reputable olive oil brand?

Consumer Reports, from 10 years ago: https://imgur.com/a/ChyyFnw Personally I only purchase California olive oil, I don't trust anything coming out of Europe due to the risk of adulteration. If you want a widely available brand: California Olive Ranch but look at the label carefully, you only want their 100% California olive oil.

I also only purchase California olive oil. Costco has big bottles for around $20 and it might be single origin too, I can't recall at the moment.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#180

Post by adrian_b »

telchior wrote: post #140
csunbird wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not the good old sunflower oil?

Sunflower oil has even higher PUFA content than soybean, which is presumably the cause of these health issues in mice. I believe soybean was just chosen for the study because it's extremely ubiquitous in the US. edit: Partially wrong! I'm told above that high oleic sunflower oil has a different profile with less linoleic oil, and apparently it's becoming more common: https://www.nutritionletter.tufts.edu/general-nutr…

Besides traditional sunflower oil, which contains mostly linoleic acid (a PUFA), now there is "high oleic sunflower oil", which is extracted from a variety of sunflower initially developed in Russia some 50 years ago, but now grown in most countries.

This non-traditional sunflower oil has little PUFA and it is perfect for frying and baking.

The sunflower variety grown for high oleic oil has a genetic mutation with this effect, but it was not obtained with the modern genetic modification technologies, because obviously such technologies did not exist in the Soviet Union in the seventies of last century.

Instead of that, the Russians have treated some sunflower seeds with a chemical known to cause random genetic mutations. Then they have grown and selected several generations of plants until they have found one type with the desired characteristic of producing oil consisting mainly of oleic acid.

Later analysis has shown that this is due to a single mutation, which diminishes the activity of the enzyme that converts oleic acid into linoleic acid in traditional sunflower plants.

Post reply on HN