Live data from Hacker News

Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

cnn.com

371–380 of 1001 posts

Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#371
post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Simply because “a couple thousand” is all that’s needed during ordinary times. Yes but.. extraordinary times exist, if we were sane we would prepare for crises before they happen, because we always knew that it would hit us eventually, people have been warning about this for ages, this is not some black swan. More healthcare capacity would help, just like more supply chain capacity would help, or the ability to manu…

This is also about appreciation. The main bottleneck for increasing capacity is not machines, rooms or beds, those are available. It's hospital staff that's lacking. ICU beds are the most staff intensive beds in a hospital. It's a job that requires years of training, so you can't just scale it up. Also, the willingness to be a nurse has decreased during the last couple months. A lot of hospital staff has burned out d…

> Also, the willingness to be a nurse has decreased during the last couple months

this was entirely preventable by providing nurses and those keeping hospitals running with the support they need to do suchs jobs during a time of crisis.

In the netherlands for instance, many nurses have been running 12h shifts during the peaks, and there has been very little practical support in helping those people.

I am not even talking about monetary funds, but mainly practical stuff. (for instance, some volunteers decided to do grocery shopping for nurses during peaks).

If people are busting their ass off to prevent the healthcare systems from collepsing, maybe the goverment should have done far more in its power to prevent those people from quitting.

Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#372

I am double vaccinated, pro vax, would get booster if I can, but if this happens in my country I will join the riots. I dont have solution, but if people dont want to get vaccinated they shouldn't be forced, period. I am afraid this pressure will create people that are against all vaccines, and when we get like 20% of new parents not vaccinating their new lockdown babies (which are a lot, everyone i know who can be p…

send families 1 test per week so they can stop the spread quicker This is a great idea, and I'm really curious why we don't have something like this, just mail a free mask and a free test to every address once a week, with a form to request more for larger households, or to request that they stop.

5 tests are 14Eur here, me and my wife test weekly, and our daughter we test every 2-3 days, so we can isolate asap, but none of my neighbours do that. And multiple times people didnt even test with symptoms.

It would cost ~50 euro per family per month, which is quite expensive, but possibly if they use some sort of model to give tests to people with higher probability of getting sick (e.g. if your child was in a school that got N positive tests recently) maybe it can be reduced to 5 euro per family per month.

Somehow I feel this is a missed opportunity to get things a bit better, I dont think people will infect other people on purpose.

Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#373
post #90

Very thought-provoking this mistreatment of the unvaccinated. The process started with demonizing them to the point of being singled out and blamed for how the disease is impacting society. When the discrimination started, there were very few willing to speak for them. Particularly malicious was the expansion of the term anti-vaxxer typically used for a fringe minority which “rejects all vaccines for everyone” to all…

Being willfully unvaccinated signals that you simply don't care about the people you come in contact with. I'm not sure how, exactly, I'm supposed to treat someone well if they won't care if I live or die from something they can prevent.

Yes, I understand the vaccine isn't perfect, but none of them are. Yet here I am, not catching polio and other things because of them. (Polio was less lethal, btw, and some folks were fine - yet others lived out their lives in an iron lung).

Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#374

Realistically: 1) Mandatory vaccination, all age groups, boosters etc. AND 2) permanently reconfiguring our society to reduce social contacts such that with the vaccines, COVID is suppressed. If the vaccines work well, then small (maybe no) changes will be needed. If they don't, then large changes. WFH, no indoor hospitality etc. We can cycle through lockdowns, we can wring our hands about vaccinating children, we ca…

Nah, what you saying is not realistical. This is more like wishful thinking and would only work in suppressive utopia (if that’s a thing).

We as a society had only one shot at doing a lockdown that could work and it was at the beginning of march 2020. Some countries actually managed to have almost no cases but they had to do harsh lockdowns and everyone needed to comply. After that with 2nd and 3rd waves we have seen less and less countries do lockdowns and people already worn out stopped to comply. Now everything is half assed and on top of that vaccinated people are extremely unwilling to participate in lockdowns as it was promised that vaccines will help us avoid the disaster of lockdowns we have seen earlier (i got vaccinated based on that as many of my friends).

So no. This is not realistical, nope.

Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#375
post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sweden did not keep _everything_ open. We found a sweet spot between "business as usual" and "everybody stays at home". For example, big gatherings and sport events were not allowed. Schools were open only for younger kids.

A sweet spot, were the elderly first were not properly protected, and then euthanized instead of given at least a treatment effort? Not even C-Pap, just panic-relieve and pain-medication. Not even given a choice, just scratched out of the book by politics. https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN2841CG It was a reckless betrayal of the elderly population of sweden. I'm all for the freedom of self-euthanization, if a p…

[deleted]

Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Swedes wore their masks and got vaccinated. What worked for them would not necessarily have worked for us.

We certainly got vaccinated, but it could be better. But masks are few and far between. There was a recommendation to wear them on some public transport for a while (and might come back, due to Omicron), but my very unscientific anecdata I'd say less than 1% of people I see wear masks. Going through the central station in Stockholm in rush hour, seeing hundreds if not thousands of people, and you can probably count t…

And everyone always forgets those politicians who had to resign after making millions on the mask deals, and pretend that this corruption has nothing to do with why Germany has the mask mandates...

Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#377

I am double vaccinated, pro vax, would get booster if I can, but if this happens in my country I will join the riots. I dont have solution, but if people dont want to get vaccinated they shouldn't be forced, period. I am afraid this pressure will create people that are against all vaccines, and when we get like 20% of new parents not vaccinating their new lockdown babies (which are a lot, everyone i know who can be p…

I had covid, but have no certificate with PCR test. I had positive home self test. I did not want to ride bus and visit hospital, with 38 degree fever, to get official PCR test. Instead I just self isolated for 2 weeks like an idiot.

They will now force me to take a shot. I have to risk severe alergic reaction.

I am also vaccinated, but Jansen does not count anymore.

Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#378
post #153

As a foreigner living in Germany I could live with it if there were otherwise sound measures, but it's mostly been a bunch of wishful thinking. There was a rush last summer to open everything up despite it being relatively clear it was way too early and a lot of people really understood it as "corona is over". Even this I could understand, but this year they do the same thing again! Surprise, surprise that there is a…

"open everything up despite it being relatively clear it was way too early" It probably wasn't. There have been 2 major studies on the effects of covid-lockdown measures, they show a small increase in total mortality. So we should have done as the Swedes and kept everything open from beginning to end.

If Swedish hospitals exceeded capacity as has happened in other nations (like the US) then there would have been more severe restrictions. The name of the game is and always has been "don't let this very contagious virus collapse our healthcare systems".

The "we should have never shut anything down" contingent doesn't seem to understand this.

Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#379

As a foreigner living in Germany I could live with it if there were otherwise sound measures, but it's mostly been a bunch of wishful thinking. There was a rush last summer to open everything up despite it being relatively clear it was way too early and a lot of people really understood it as "corona is over". Even this I could understand, but this year they do the same thing again! Surprise, surprise that there is a…

No democratic country is built to handle something like a pandemic. That much became clear the last two years. You need to be able to mandate strict laws that take away a lot of liberties that we have learn to consider as standard.

Many countries do currently mandate strict laws that take away a lot of liberties. Australia, Canada, Europe, parts of US. Are they still democracies?

Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#380
post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Swedes wore their masks and got vaccinated. What worked for them would not necessarily have worked for us.

I'm not sure who "us" is for you, but Swedes are not vaccinated at an especially high rate. They're at about the EU average. 8-10% above the US average, 5-7% above California, but a few percent below New England, for example.

Why would you get vaccinated for something that you're not in a risk group for anyway, it doesn't make any sense. And even double vaccines and boosters. If you did this pre-covid the doctor would have diagnosed you a hypochondric
Post reply on HN