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Apple Will Not Reinstate Epic’s Fortnite Developer Account

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Re: Apple Will Not Reinstate Epic’s Fortnite Developer Account

#331

Post by wvenable »

sixstringtheory wrote: post #325
wvenable wrote: post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What if the TV manufacturer didn't even need retail distribution because they have their own warehouses, trucks, etc and will gladly send you a TV for $0 and charge on-device subscription fees to cover it. But sadly, you bought your home in a neighborhood with an HOA, and even though you own your home, the HOA requires all retail purchases have to go through them, and they take a 30% cut of everything and they won't…

Then you’d have a different situation. The warehouses, trucks etc are the app store and iPhones. In order for that TV manufacturer to have their own, they’d have to build their own devices, OS and cloud services.

The iPhone is your house -- you own that. The HOA is Apple -- the people who make the rules. The trucks and warehouses are the servers and the internet.

Epic already runs a store they don't need the app store to distribute their apps and do payments. They're only required because Apple gives them no other option.

Re: Apple Will Not Reinstate Epic’s Fortnite Developer Account

#332

Post by wayneftw »

p2t2p wrote: post #315
wayneftw wrote: post #273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody scales an app business just on Android. When you have to target both, you'll follow Apples rules. Where are my PWA notifications on iPhone? Where is my replacement app launcher? Where are my programming apps? Where are my porn apps?

So you claim that it is lack of imagination that I don't want to install porn apps and receive notification spam from every website on the internet? Also I don't see how can innovation be equated with support of PWA notifications and porn apps and launchers?

Yeah, because we're only talking about what you want not the general you.

Re: Apple Will Not Reinstate Epic’s Fortnite Developer Account

#333

Post by wvenable »

someluccc wrote: post #323
wvenable wrote: post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What if the TV manufacturer didn't even need retail distribution because they have their own warehouses, trucks, etc and will gladly send you a TV for $0 and charge on-device subscription fees to cover it. But sadly, you bought your home in a neighborhood with an HOA, and even though you own your home, the HOA requires all retail purchases have to go through them, and they take a 30% cut of everything and they won't…

Well but that TV requires power lines to operate, and fiber to get its content. Insofar as the neighborhood (or whoever) paid for those, they deserve a cut too.

The HOA forces you to use their power and fiber, so in that case sure. But if you could get power and fiber directly from the TV manufacturer or someone else, then the HOA doesn't need a cut.

In this case, the TV manufacturer already has all that infrastructure and they use it in neighborhoods without an HOA. It would be no cost to you or the HOA for you use it but the HOA just doesn't allow it. For obvious reasons, of course, because then they wouldn't get their cut.

Re: Apple Will Not Reinstate Epic’s Fortnite Developer Account

#334

Post by tyingq »

mattcantstop wrote: post #193

I understand Apple's decision to do this. They want to stick it to Epic. Completely understandable desire on Apple's part. But, sadly, Apple is letting their desire to get vengeance outweigh the interests of their users in having all the games they want to play on their devices. I have been realizing lately that my loyalty to Apple has been waning over the years after having invested heavily in the ecosystem. This is…

I think Apple is also risking what this all looks like to lawmakers. Lawmakers who currently seem to be in a frenzy around anti-trust and/or anti-competitive behavior.

Re: Apple Will Not Reinstate Epic’s Fortnite Developer Account

#335

Post by ryanlol »

kllrnohj wrote: post #253
ryanlol wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? Apple hasn’t lost their 30%, and there’s no indication that they will.

Apple lost their exclusivity on in-app-payments: > Rogers issued an injunction that said Apple will no longer be allowed to prohibit developers from providing links or other communications that direct users away from Apple in-app purchasing. https://www.cnbc.com/2021/09/10/epic-games-v-apple-judge-rea... So Apple didn't "lose" their 30% exactly, but everyone is now free to do what Fortnite originally did and that's l…

Irrelevant, the judgement says apple can still take 30% even if you do that.

Re: Apple Will Not Reinstate Epic’s Fortnite Developer Account

#336

Post by busterarm »

passivate wrote: post #316
stephenr wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

s/got in a spat/had years of repeated customer issues because of GPUs shitting the bed/

I think it was a system design issue because of lack of proper cooling from the integrator (Apple). Maybe someone can look it up, I'm going off of memory here..

Apple's slavish obsession with passive cooling, indeed. It doesn't matter how many times it has been proven to be a bad idea, they're still going to use it.

Re: Apple Will Not Reinstate Epic’s Fortnite Developer Account

#337

Post by passivate »

jasode wrote: post #8

It's interesting to compare the situation Epic got itself into with previous episodes of Facebook & Google breaking Apple's rules. When Facebook and Google misused Developer Enterprise certificates to go beyond internal testing and distribute apps to end-consumers , Apple revoked their accounts. Both Facebook & Google simply admitted they screwed up and Apple reinstated their accounts.[1] No lawsuits. Epic broke Appl…

>Big difference is that Epic rolled the dice by filing a lawsuit about Apple's unfair rules and because they thought there was enough anti-Apple sentiment that they'd get a sympathetic judgement in their favor.

I think they're doing a great service (at their cost) to raise the issue time and time again. After Apple, I think Steam and other platforms are next. Pretty much all developers who make money on the app store agree with Epic on the fact that Apple should not engage in a 30% money-grab.

Re: Apple Will Not Reinstate Epic’s Fortnite Developer Account

#338

Post by eldaisfish »

sbuk wrote: post #268
xyzzy21 wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It may also be illegal both from an anti-trust legal view and from a contract legal view. IANAL but I hire them frequently for advice.

The judge literally just ruled that it wasn't.

.. based on precedents where none of them were digital. Every single precedent cited in this judgement pre-internet.

Re: Apple Will Not Reinstate Epic’s Fortnite Developer Account

#339

Post by davidw »

mattcantstop wrote: post #193

I understand Apple's decision to do this. They want to stick it to Epic. Completely understandable desire on Apple's part. But, sadly, Apple is letting their desire to get vengeance outweigh the interests of their users in having all the games they want to play on their devices. I have been realizing lately that my loyalty to Apple has been waning over the years after having invested heavily in the ecosystem. This is…

I tried to explain the details to my son, but he's just disappointed that he can't play a game he liked. He wants to buy a Windows computer and is saving up for it.

Trying to get him interested in writing a bit of code, which to me is more fun in some ways than playing games, without pushing it too hard, and so far no luck.

Re: Apple Will Not Reinstate Epic’s Fortnite Developer Account

#340

Post by smiley1437 »

jfoster wrote: post #164
smiley1437 wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Tell me again why would _you_ do business with anyone like that? > me looking at the massive pile of money fortnite generates Yes. Even if it risks your future earnings of literally hundreds of billions of dollars? Apple made about 100 million (0.1 billion) from Fortnite. A lot of money, to be sure. https://fortune.com/2021/05/19/apple-fortnite-epic-games-100... But 2020 App store gross revenue was 72 billion, 30%…

Your premise seems to be that Epic being back on the app store increases the risk of change for Apple, but I would argue that making some degree of peace with Epic definitely decreases the risk of change for Apple. The only way I can rationalise Apple not allowing them back on is that Apple would like for that to be part of a settlement agreement.

Apple was 'at peace' with Epic before, right up until they got stabbed in the back with the hidden alternative payment option snuck into the game.

Fool me once, shame on you.

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